Ontario, CanadaMain: -Any% No S+Q/WW/OoB -Any% -100% -Any% No WW/OoB
Misc: -All Instruments -Legacy
ACE should really just be banned. It hasn't worked on any console it's been tried on, and really shouldn't have even been allowed until proven on console. But if people really want it, it's for Gambatte only, and should be a misc category.
I wouldn't bother with credits warp honestly, because at this point, it's emulator only (Gambatte) for LADX and really shouldn't be allowed anymore.
As for main category, Riddler's video + Cravone's video on the changes should help. Also using a video of a run with the current route like GreenTunic's could be helpful(I dunno if the video zorlax has uploaded is his newest or current route stuff, which is why I say GT's video lol)
I don't know why we have ace allowed in the first place :( For speedruns, tricks should have to be proved doable on console first :/
It's a pretty low chance of softlocking to be honest. It happens usually when you get the auto 2 drop, which is harder to tell when it happens when you're doing unbuffered, but it's still pretty rare, and only a few combinations of subpixels will probably mess it up.
It's probably pretty normal to go a long time without softlocking. It's possible you could never soft lock with it. I just wanted to let you know there is a chance it could happen some day lol
That is the same as Rapid's method Payki. And I can guarantee you there IS a chance to softlock that method. I talk about that exact method failing in my video. It may not be a high chance, but certain subpixel combinations WILL cause that method to softlock.
Zorlax asked me to test his method out, and from all that I can tell, it is a consistent method. Using frame advance, his method and my original method are about the same time, but for RTA; I would suggest Zorlax's method for it's ease of use and because you don't have to worry about your subpixel due to it's non-diagonal movement.
Currently, the majority of people use the ocarina skip route, so that's probably the route to write down?
I just want to reply to confirm a lot of what Zorlax is saying, in that Keeping Bow-Wow and Skipping Ocarina is closer to a 15-30 second save(after talking with Zorlax about it the other week)
I've found it closer to 30 seconds than 15 personally because Getting PoP in D5 is actually pretty consistent. Also, D6 PoP is possible pending a good armos maze where Bow Wow eats pretty few things. But I count that as not happening when calculating the time saves/losses from ocarina skip route.
The only thing I don't agree with is that it leads to fewer resets, cause there's no reason you should need to reset from Walrus skip at this point anymore.
Bow Wow does make rooster skip a tiny bit more dangerous. It's not as bad as people think usually though once you're able to not worry about him during your rooster skip.
I still stand by skipping ocarina as the best route since the only downside I see overall is the rooster skip danger.
Well, I don't think there are too many changes since you left. But I guess I'll list the main changes since the original SJ route just to make sure?
The first thing is the possibility of owl skip after moblin. When you get in front of the chest for the tail key, if you're not clipped into the chest, and came up from below, on the left half of it(I find this works best for me), if you press A+B+Start+Select in a way that it opens the chest as you're pressing those 4 buttons, and you buffer those 4 buttons AGAIN out of that S+Q menu to skip the text, then buffer down to walk straight down, you should be able to get low enough that by holding down the whole time, you'll walk off the screen as the owl appears, but before his text starts.
Flock Clip after bow wow to get to D2
In D2 there is a strategy to get the bracelet without killing the ghosts by standing in the doorway until both ghosts are within one tile of the doorway and slashing and standing still causing them to appear on the otherside of the room and run off the screen despawning and completing the room, saving probably 1 second.
After D3 you head right instead of up the stairs to get to animal village right away as we now skip ocarina and skip returning bow wow for the most optimal route.
You then do the walrus skip in whatever method you want(Obviously I suggest mine to eliminate the small chance you end up on a subpixel combination that ruins whatever method of escape you usually use) After you get past the Walrus, you need to enter the cave to the right of the screen with Lanmola on it to unlock your menu and items from doing Walrus Skip.
After you get the flippers you go straight to D5 since you don't get the ocarina, you don't need mambo.
D5 is a bit different without mambo. After the first key you walk back and kill the 2 helmasaur. After you get the BK you fall in the pit to warp to the stairs, then go through the water again. The easiest route is to go down+right below the first 2 bloopers, jump up to the ceiling before the next screen and then hold down+right again to get under the next 2 bloopers, then jump up out of the water after you get passed them. Once out of the water you go down a screen, then right and you should know the way back to the beginning of the dungeon to go get the hookshot. After you get the hookshot, you have to walk back again, so make sure you have sword equipped to destroy the crystal, then equip hookshot so you can kill the helmasaur quickly. It 1 shots them from behind or the sides, and 2 shots the front of their face since it steals the mask first shot. Then continue to the boss like normal.
In D6, it's possible to avoid the 2nd super jump by not opening the chest before the 1st super jump then flock clipping on the keyblock the screen below, going up and getting the key. I haven't noticed a big difference in the timing between that method and the 2nd super jump method due to having to pick up the 2 pots, and equip sword, vs keeping your equips(also makes for quicker equips going into dog fight) and flock clipping and going up an extra screen. Timing them myself, they were very similar in time depending on how quickly you got the super jump, still the chance of you soft locking if you're not careful that way though.
After D6, since you don't have mambo, you need to go down a screen and talk to the owl, then fall off the edge into the water, go left a screen, then swim up the 1 wide river, and swim up all the way until you reach the stairs near the d4 keyhole area and just go left on your way to rooster skip. There is an alternate path to the left at one point to get onto ground quicker up the river and run straight up, but in all my testing, it was always faster to just swim up the river.
Rooster skip is a little different with bow wow, as there's now a bit of a chance that he blocks your hookshots; so it's a little frustrating, but not as bad as it seems at first. You just have to get over thoughts of worrying about him. Worrying about him getting in your way screws you up more often than he actually gets in the way.
Once you get to D8 entrance, make sure that bow wow eats the moblin on the screen with the phone house before you do the bomb trigger. If he won't eat him right away, move onto the d8 entrance screen and then back onto the moblin screen to have him eat the moblin right away like every time. Then you're able to do the bomb trigger without worrying about it failing. Oh yea, in D8, no more blaino skip, so you go down right away, kill blaino, go up, SJ, get rod, jump down and go through portal back to the beginning of D8 at that point. After D8, you have to walk out of the turtle head, right and down the ledge, going through the swamp to head to tal tal heights and get to D7.
In D7, after you break the 3rd pillar, do NOT shoot a bomb arrow at the wall, just drop a bomb to open the wall, since arrows will make it so you can't do the bomb trigger. Then do a bomb trigger going down into the screen below. It will activate the pillar falling, then you just move the blocks to your left, go left and down, around and up to the boss key skip to finish the dungeon like usual.
After D4 instrument, outside you need to go down the stairs beside D4 and walk your way to the windfish egg. At the windfish egg you need to do a bomb trigger going into the screen with the egg so that you activate the cutscene without the ocarina.
I don't think I'm missing anything? Sorry if it's a little over detailed but I assume that covers all the changes? I dunno how much of the detail is necessary or how many of those things are necessary, but I'm sure you can decide what is needed or not. There alternate routes as well that lose some potential time like returning bow wow and getting ocarina, or not doing owl skip.
Edit: LOL Seeing the post on the page, I MAYYY have written a BIT much?
Moderators actually have the ability to to add an extra "Variable" to be set on the leaderboards which could have a column for "ACE" like they have a column for "Platform" and "Time" and "Player" etc. Where users could enter Yes or No, and it could be set for the Any% Category only instead of making a whole other category; as a way for people to see whether ACE was used in the run or not.
Honestly it seems unneeded since it's kinda obvious which runs are ace and which aren't at this point. The category is any%. Having another category for any% before ace is no different than adding Zorlax% category to leaderboards and separating runs that way, it's just kinda undeeded. Games evolve and routes change :S
LOL You also return bow wow in your run. You only need to kill the moblin if you have bow wow, otherwise there's no issues doing that bomb trigger :P
Getting hit by the moblin does NOT reset your subpixel. Being hit by hit arrow, or jumping into him, or him walking into you. They don't reset your subpixel. If you jump into him and get knocked around, it can change your subpixel, but you won't know what it changed it to; it's no different than trying to get lucky by walking diagonal lol
As show in the video, jumping again the boundary in a cardinal direction DOES change one of your subpixel values.
Just make sure the moblin is dead, or you risk the trigger not working unless you get the auto 2 bomb drop on a certain subpixel combination.
Well, after messing around with Frog Song Skip to open D8 with bomb trigger while you have bow wow, it seems that it is actually an issue caused by having the moblin on the screen with the phone house alive while you try the trick. As long as bow wow eats him or you kill him, the double buffer method should work just fine, and I assume other methods should still work. The bird has nothing to do with it like previous people have thought, at least from all my testing. Also, it CAN work if the moblin is still alive, but ONLY if you get the auto double bomb drop which you can't really be consistent at, so the most consistent way to guarentee it is to just have bow wow eat the moblin or kill it yourself before you do the bomb trigger to open D8.
So this is section of a VOD where I go over the only 100% consistent method of doing walrus skip to avoid the possibility of softlocking (at least with everything we know about it so far).
Also go explain and demonstrate how any other method that does not use subpixel control will never be 100% consistent and will always have a chance to softlock. _
Make sure that you're doing the first inputs out of a pause buffer so you use the double pause buffer method I show with every bomb trigger in the run; from my experience it is also consistent for the other bomb triggers(haven't tried out a ton of values for opening d8 with bow wow though due to lack of save state).
Well, good luck! I'll be sure to stop by if I see you.
If you have any other questions, feel free to ask any time~
Glad it helped man! I find rooster skip is definitely the most difficult part of the run to be consistent at, but at least there are little things, like that, which you can to to make it a little less difficult.
Hope to see you running sometime soon since you're already working on rooster skip :P
I had this problem at one point as well. The issue is that you're pressing the jump and hookshot button too close to eachother, so it's treating it as if you're pressing both at the same time. You need a LITTLE bit more time between each press than you're giving it, but not too much where you hookshot too late.
If you happen to press them at the same time, or too close together, and you jump in place, make sure you do a hookshot once after that without trying to hookshot jump, and then continue trying on the NEXT hookshot after that. If you try to hookshot jump after you jump in place, you'll just automatically fall into the hole, and that's not fun times, so yea, just do the above to fix it and you should be alright to keep going on your attempts.
