Of course, you could just practice the normal route for the game up until Veran Warp on your German cart; obviously you wouldn't finish a run this way, but it would get you the practice for the rest of the game until you get a US cart. Veran warp is the only difference between the games really, other than text boxes of course.

The only route that finishes the game without Veran Warp is doing "No Map Glitch"; which is a category that Drenn does to enjoy the full game. Veran warp lets you skip dungeon 7 & 8; also letting you skip half of D4, and 80% of D5. If you do No Map Glitch, you have to do all of those things, which won't do much in helping you learn Any%.

I would definitely recommend just learning the Any% route, and doing it up until the end right before Veran Warp, and just do that until you get a US cart, or you could play on an emulator with a US rom; but I assume you prefer console.

As it was brought up in the other thread; Villa Skip is an issue I think. For the current ruleset we have, you can make the argument that pits are an accessible tile, although you can't stay on them, you can access them normally, and thus you can transition off that screen using that pit tile. While for mab's suggested ruleset, I can't see an argument for villa skip, since it's not a natural transition. That slight difference in wording makes a world of difference in application. Unless the wording is only for in dungeons, but then what are the rules for the overworld?

Zorlax, you're wrong again on the Seabass definition. I don't think you quite understand what it entails in way way of the D8 raised blocks. You're ALLOWED to be ON blocks that are 1 tile adjacent to a naturally accessible tile. So if Those raised blocks in D8 aren't natrually accessible due to the situational side; then you're allowed to SJ on them, and then walk off them onto the natural accessible tiles above them and walk up to the magic rod.

BUT when you're ON those blocks that aren't naturally accessible, that ARE adjacent to a tile that is naturally accessible, you're NOT allowed to transition. You can only transition screens while on a tile that IS naturally accessible.

The discussion here is whether being on top of those raised blocks count as naturally accessible because you can get on other ones in the game in certain ways, but you can't get on THOSE ones without super jump.

And again, as for your villa skip comparison, pits are accessible tiles. You can walk into them, or jump on them without SJ's The "lowest pixel" is not a tile..We're working in terms of tiles in this definition.

But either way, people seem to be on the universal side from what I've seen

From the situational side; Rapid, looking in that room, there's no way to fall on those blocks because it's the highest floor, there's no switch in that room, so you couldn't get on top of those blocks without SJ. Therefore it's not naturally accessible. It's quite easy to disagree with that logic from the situational stand point. It's the same thing in D8; but you're not screen transitioning while on those rising blocks, and there is walkable area next to it, so it breaks no rules from that stand point; you can just walk off them since they're within 1 block of a normally accessible tile.

I really like that BK skip, but to me it's just illogical against the ruleset.

As for the Villa Skip comparison; I consider pits as tiles you can naturally access because you can move to them without glitches, even though you fall in them as well, so transitioning down on them is no issue, and you land on a walkable space, so I see no reason to compare them.

Zorlax, it has nothing to do with accessing a room or area you couldn't get to at that point in the run. It has to do with accessing that area by transitioning when you're on a block you couldn't get onto without SJ..According to the ruleset we decided on, you cannot transition unless you're transitioning from a tile you can naturally access. The discussion is whether we consider getting on top of those blocks natural or not based on universal access or situational access to that block.

It has come to my attention due to this rule discussion ongoing currently that the D7 BK Skip may be controversial to the rules in that standing on raised blocks has two different possibilities.

Either standing on raised blocks is a universal rule, or it is a situational rule. There is definitely merit to both sides of the argument.

On the Universal side; You are able to fall onto raised blocks, and you are able to stand on them, and raise them with a switch in where you are still standing on them raised and can walk on them; so it IS intended that you can walk on certain raised block.

But on the situational side; you have to consider that SOME raised blocks were not intended to be walked on; these are where there is no way for the play to normally fall onto them from a higher floor, and there is no switch near those blocks in order for you to be able to raise them under you; therefore you could never actually get onto those blocks without a super jump.

There is generally no issue with this rule with which ever side you stand on because there is walkable tiles within 1 space of them; but when it comes to the D7 BK skip, you are leaving the room while NOT on a normal walkable tile, which goes against the current definition. Also for mab's proposed ruleset; if you are on the situational side, it is an unnatural way of leaving the room because you could not naturally get on those blocks while they are raised.

Here is the situation in question:

Due to this affecting both possible rulesets, it seems like the best solution is to discuss this seperately just to see where people stand on how they see these blocks.

I personally on on the side that they are situational just because it makes logical sense to me that you could not get on those blocks without the super jumps, but apparently there are others who are on the universal side; so it's best if we get a consensus of peoples opinions on this.

Also, I'm not sure how your rules work in regards to the D7 BK skip Mab...I wouldn't call walking on the raising blocks through a transition a natural exit to the room with the blocks up.

Either way, I'd be okay with either rule set. The original is my preference, but both are ok and generally clear to me; I just want this all sorted out QUICKLY...I want to get running, and I don't want to run while these discussions are going on at all.

A cleared up definition of the current ruleset in terms of out of bounds in regards to super jumps:

You can Super Jump to an area that is within 1 adjacent(left, right, above or below; not diagonal) tile of a normally accessible tile, where normally is defined as a tile which the player can reach in normal gameplay without the use of glitches. You may only transition screens while on a normally(as defined previously) accessible tile. So, while on tiles that are within 1 adjacent tile, you may not transition screens.

(I think that covers everything that was previously discussed/decided on; let me know if I'm missing anything.)

I still like the original one we had that Seabass came up with of Only being allowed to SJ to an area that is within 1 adjacent(left right, above or below; not diagonal) of a NORMALLY walkable area(normally being defined as a walkable tile you can reach without using any kinds of glitches).

As mab has pointed out though on twitter, there has been a SJ that breaks this rule used in runs. That SJ being the Blaino Skip SJ. I'm pretty sure this was an oversight when we refined the rules to the walkable block having to be reachable without using a glitch(which stopped us from doing Flame Skip "v2").

This SJ is now obsolete with the route change of skipping mambo(and the ocarina); so I don't think old runs should be invalidated due to this, but I think that blaino skip should be disallowed for all future runs, and the rule of SJing only being allowed to jump to a block that is within 1 adjacent tile distance from a normally walkable tile being the rule by which SJ oob's is defined.

Edit: Removed my vote for now while discussions continue to make an informed decision.

Sorry I haven't replied until now. I didn't realize there was a forum on this website.

Any language is allowed. It's just that the major skip for the game "Veran Warp" which allows you to skip the final 2 dungeons, and go straight to the final form of the final boss is ONLY do-able on the English US cart/rom. (Though there is technically a way to to it on JP, it's way too convoluted/time consuming/difficult to to make it worth using over the US English version).

So you could do it on a German cart, but you wouldn't really be doing the speedrun route do to the trick not having a viable way to do the major skip. Emulator's are allowed for the Oracle games, so you could use an emulator to play the game if you don't want to get an English US cart.