Made the final change just now.

Since I can't seem to completely put in all the necessary info in the rules for every category I'll just specify here.

All runs done on the following platforms count towards the Original version (the Sega Genesis version) of the game:

• AES
• Dreamcast

And All runs done on the following platforms count towards the Modernized version (the Steam version) of the game:

• PS4
• Xbox One
• Switch

Keep this in mind when you submit to the leaderboard.

It's important that these version fall in line accordingly as the Modern and Original versions of the game are very different. For instance, the load times are faster in the modern version but the modern version is largely regarded as more difficult than the original version of the game.

This is true. It only really applies to the final boss because of the requirement to get good ending. Even in Bad Ending though, I can only really see the use of death abuse happening for Cthulu and the lab boss (Myriax I think is its name?) as the other fights end too fast to make death abuse worth it at all.

Start time remains the same but end time is when the results screen pops up now.

While all submitted runs have not had their times changed yet to coincide with this, we will get to them soon. Just want to give the heads up that all future runs submitted will need to abide by the new timing method and that all current (non-Bad Ending) runs will have their time changed accordingly.

My only concern about renaming the console category to Genesis/MegaDrive is that anyone that may run this game on the Dreamcast or AES might get confused where their runs will fall into but I think as I mentioned before we can clarify on that further with a separate thread on where each console's version (and the rules too) falls into.

Another option is we can rename the console category to "Original" as it is my understanding that this game was originally made for the Sega Genesis and then was modernized/updated for the releases of the game on more recent platforms and Steam. But yeah, just figuring out a proper name for the categories is all we have to decide on at this point. We're pretty much in agreeance that the Retro/Modern variable shouldn't be a thing so I think it's safe for me to remove that now so I'm gonna go do that shortly here.

Also the death abuse isn't just to regain the grenades, it is also serves to tack on more damage on respawn if the final boss's weak point is still open when you die and you're close enough. I'm not gonna lie though another thing that's been on the back of my mind was banning the death abuse strat I use too. There is a right and wrong time and place to do that strat but I dunno...it feels kind of cheesy to just up and die to regain all my grenades and save time because the final boss has too much downtime before he's vulnerable again in both phases.

As for the random seed stuff, I think the number of rooms you need to travel through (before the boss encounter) don't change with a different seed so time saves I don't think sway as much in favor of one seed over another there but some room layouts play more favorably to the player than others when it comes to keeping up with the enemy wave.

Having looked at all versions of gameplay I can already tell that Switch, PS4 and XboxOne resemble the Steam version (Modern) of the game, whilst the AES and Dreamcast versions resemble that of the Sega Genesis version (Retro) so we can put that in the rules description should we follow through on all of that.

Some changes have already been implemented and others have been in talks these past few days.

• Firstly, ILs are officially RIP. A game's IL community needs to be active enough to warrant its existence on any leaderboard and currently I do not feel it is so it has been removed until a time comes when this game's activity picks up again.

• Both Bad Ending and Boss Rush are relegated to the "Misc." tab. Bad Ending will remain as a category as we feel that not allowing the category to exist is gatekeeping potential new runners (due to the requirement for getting the Good Ending not being lenient) but we did need to clean up the leaderboard quite a bit so we've put it in the Misc. tab

• "Hard" is set the as default difficulty on this leaderboard, just like it was in Genesis version of the game.

• The "PC" categories are in a good spot with only 2 variables but the "Console" categories were a mess with 4 variables, making it a chore to find runs and imo at least two of them are not necessary. 1 of them has been removed already.

Those are the current changes. Gilman and I have also been talking about changing where time ends in the Good Ending run to the results screen signaling the end of "The HQ" stage. This is because the player still has control past the point where the current end time happens and the stage doesn't end until you perform one last roll into Dr. Herzog so we both feel the results screen is a better spot to end the timer at.

We also both agree that "Retro" and "Modern" are fundamentally different versions of XenoCrisis and must remain intact in some way as separate of each other. Currently I am of the belief that all categories with "(PC)" in it should be changed to "(Modern)" as the PC Steam version resembles the "Modern" version of XenoCrisis already and all categories with "(Console)" in it should be changed to "(Retro)" and must resemble that of the original version (Sega Genesis) of the game. This will remove the other unnecessary (imo) variable that is stuck in the console category.

Yes, I will have to make a new thread discussing the differences so everyone knows which version of the game they ran on when submitting a run but the differences are very noticeable with just a little bit of watching both of them in action.

The final thing we discussed was the addition of a "Random Seed" category. Part of the draw of XenoCrisis is it's 60K+ seeds which carry many differences in map and room layouts as well enemy waves to help keep each new playthrough fresh. This of course is one we don't intend to rush into changing so for now, we will stay put on this idea but we definitely have been in talks about it.

This is good info. I might actually look into that since my hands tend to wonder off cam at times.

Yes...the mods are aware that his run no longer exists. No...we are not taking it off the leaderboard.

For those that are not aware, sumpura went under the alias of Baize and this is not the first time he has disappeared without a trace and wiped all of his runs.

He has shared his wisdom with other runners like his discovery of a new quick kill for the truck fight as well as piecing together a strat for the idea we had of a sheildless zeed kill. All of these strats are a part of the current route as it stands today and he was instrumental in all of that.

sumpura's PB was the world's first ever sub-13 minute time for this game too which is a big milestone for where this game was at at the time. It's an important piece of history and we know he streamed his attempts trying to get that time.

We have seen his run prior to the video being lost and we remember the 2 seconds he lost because of a bad ninja pattern just 2 rooms before the final boss. Keep in mind this was before before the discovery of the Stage 8 clip. The run existed and we saw that run ourselves plenty of times to study off of it.

We do not know why he chose to erase his existence once again but one thing is for sure, we don't believe he was trying to erase evidence of possible cheating. If that was the case, we would've heard something from mods of other communities and games Baize/sumpura has also done runs for. If something like that did happen then we are not aware of it and should be informed accordingly.

Until then, sumpura's run will remain and we will continue to hope he comes back with a new PB utilizing the stage 8 clip.

I will also edit all that information into the description of both submitted runs to give us a head start on that.

Actually you were one step ahead of me on that for your run. thank you for that. I'll work on the WR run's description then

Sorry I edited my original post one too many times here.

I think just adjusting the rule to make it required to state the revision it is played on will suffice for now.

I can actually do that right now too

I'll inject a rule making it mandatory to state the revision and version you are playing on. This is so that in the event the arcade version picks up steam down the road that we are able to have the information on hand for what I personally think should be the route to go and that is to create a brand new leaderboard exclusive to the arcade version of the game.

Because sadly...we can't make a variable to address this problem as it will mess with the NES leaderboard (where this doesn't apply).

I see that you ran Lttp. It actually has emulator rules on its leaderboard.

I'll paste em here:

"1) Allowed emulators are SNES9X (v.1.5 and later) and BSNES (including higan/byuu)"

"2) Front ends such as Retroarch and BizHawk are allowed, but additional restrictions apply (No RunAhead on RetroArch, etc.)"

These seem pretty easy to understand and follow. I was aware that SNES9X was allowed but only certain versions of it and I couldn't remember which versions.

So yeah, stick with SNES9X (run on the right version obviously). I'm not sure about OpenEmu, so I'd suggest avoiding using that for the time being.

Tested and can confirm just about everything I've stated is true.

Avoid getting into any encounter in the overworld going from Qwagmire (after deafeating Dollop) to Afralona warp spot.

If you get into an encounter during that stretch and try to warp, you warp to the ocean instead. Use the harp if this happens to warp back to the warp spot.

Obviously in this situation the warp point is bugged but the fix is easy. Enter the closest dungeon (in this case, Galadonia). This will reset everything in the overworld and fix the bug, allowing you to properly warp to Afralona.

I've had that happen to me too long ago but I forget what causes it. I want to say it's because of getting into an encounter in the overworld and dying right away to get out of said encounter and then trying to warp. Entering a dungeon and exiting out might fix that.

On actual runs it never happened to me though. Only in practice would it happen to me. That might be because I normally reset if I get into an encounter in the overworld or I get into one before Dollop's defeat.

I'd have to do some testing.

You're welcome. This fight took awhile for me to crack but I can't see myself getting a better result than this.

The adjustment has been made. Happy running this game guys!

Absolutely we can do that for you. I just have to make a variable and make sure the current runs don't get lost.

Although I don't think I can morph NoBomb into that variable for co-op runs Unless I make it a misc. category. Solo NoBomb would have to join it as well.

I will mention that it does tend to have issues running on SD2SNES but since you plan on using an emulator for practice instead, that is a non-issue.

Emulators are used for many SNES speedruns and we actually have good ones to choose from like Higan for example. This game tends to run very cleanly though with minimal to no lag save for a few rooms but that's minor for a game that spans well over an hour and a half.

As far as I know, the first five bosses are necessary to kill because porting to Afralona requires all 5 strings of the harp which are only gotten from killing all 5 bosses. If there is a way to skip to Afralona early though it would be a big break in the run.

There is a shortcut from Deeso straight to Atlena and that does save time to use but unfortunately you still have to kill the boss in Deeso for the harp string.