Ok so my Any% run didn't get all the points. After some testing it turns out the New Desert Strat didn't cause this. Also it turns out after looking at Pawdugan's run, his Any%/100% run isn't 100% ether. I know this because when he saved, he had 231 Points. Use the cheese is 5 and the whole boss fight gives you 20. 231+25=256 256/260. I know he's off by 4 points because he didn't wait for the game to tell him he's hungry. So when he ate the lamb, it didn't give him the points.

Now I did everything I know is right to get 100% including the Lamb, but somehow I ended up getting only 252 points, 4 more points lost then Paw. So WTF happened? Is there a glitch or something where the game doesn't give you points for no reason?

Edit: For Reference, here is a page showing where you get all the points from. http://www.sierrahelp.com/Misc/PointLists/KQ5Points.html

Edit 2: I looked at the other 2nd place 100% run and that isn't 100% ether. The points there are the same as my Any% WR run. I'm starting to think 100% is not possible. You know the run is 100% if you have 235 Points before throwing the cheese in the machine.

SOLUTION FOUND: Give Stick to Dog and Boot to Cat, Don't use the Iron Bar/Gate Glitch

We'll have to do some more research into this! I was worried about the lamb points but never took the time to check out the footage to see if the points counted or not. I'll revisit that run and do a point by point analysis of my route. For now though, congrats on the new time!!

Just re-confirmed this, but you don't get points for throwing the stick at the cat, only if you throw the boot (4 points). Curiously, it doesn't matter whether you use the stick or boot to get rid of the dog - 4 points either way. So, to an extent, when the desert is done plays a part in this, but only in relation to how best to optimize the rest of Serenia, as there's nothing in the desert that you can actually miss. What I do is give the fish to the bear right away, grab the stick and honey, then enter the desert from that screen (then moving up 2 screens to reach the cliff face - doesn't affect survival, being at the desert borders). Mostly I do this to minimize unnecessary movement after grabbing the honey, but this also means both the stick and boot are in my inventory when I chase off the dog (after the desert).

The remaining 4 point loss is actually a side-effect of doing the grate skip when entering the catacombs. I noticed that doing so doesn't actually award points (supposed to be 4, I think). So, that instance I would just make a note of in your videos when you're successful with the glitch. The other alternative would be to ban the glitch altogether, however, actually using the crowbar on the grate is still required and plainly seen by the viewers, just that the points are awarded when the grate is seen propped open (or thereabouts anyway).

I have tested this and you are correct. It's kind of crazy that 2 small details like that can change if it's 100% or not. Also the fastest movement for 100% PC now is the same movement I did for my NES run. Also I'm going to try to get to be Mod for this game. That way someone can be more focused on this. Only 100% runs that are correct right now are the NES ones and that version always gives you 100%

The dog + boot and cat + stick scenario pretty much amounts to a route error, IMO (similar point loss occurs if you do the gold needle with the gypsy, and the gold coin with the tailor). So, no issues with changing that.

But I think it'd be fine to still include the grate skip glitch, just so long as a runner makes note of it. I mean, we should get input from the other runners about what to do, but as I mentioned above, you're still performing the action that would ordinarily give the points. So, I'd be fine with still trying to use the glitch (although, I doubt I'll really touch the 100% category for this game, so take that as you will).

I did a test and the difference between using the Gate Glitch and not using it is about 10 seconds. I think that's good enough to not have it be aloud in 100% given how optimized you can get the time down . We'll see what Pawdugan thinks. Him and I are the only runnners of this at the moment, thought Pawdugan is more of a youtuber then a speedrunner. Though I think he'd do more of the KQ series at least because of the history he's had with the games.