Unfortunately, as I was looking at runs, I realized I hadn't laid out emulator rules clearly enough, and so added this note to all category rules. This is standard practice for acceptable emulator runs across the site (to my knowledge). If we ever can confirm that save states don't preserve state in any exploitable way, I'd be glad to change the policy.
"For all categories where emulator is accepted, using save states, especially to initiate ILs or fastest victory, but even to initiate full game runs, is not allowed. We don't know enough about the game RNG to say that save states aren't allowing people to carry initial RNG over and grind a specific AI position in the RNG, and that's something you simply can't reproduce on hardware. If understood to my satisfaction, this policy could change. The game has the ability to quit out of fights and rematch which should be sufficient."
the fights are less than 10sec, quitting a fight and start it again takes almost 1min brother...
So the unknown here, and it's something i want to investigate as quickly as I can, is whether you can use a save state to get repetitive behavior on the part of the AI. I get it's a disk game and i don't love it. This, admittedly, is all a function of emulation and console being on the same board for these: if we separated them out then it would at least be fine. If people would prefer that so that they can keep grinding, I can do that instead. Otherwise, I'm just gonna need to find a bit of time to dig.
Okay, quick test, this is pretty clearly exploitable: my opponent's moves are differently timed and chosen based on which pre-fight savestate I use, and whenever I hold the exact same button from the start (or none at all), the enemy actions are exactly the same. I would be willing to do a board or category that allows this, but I can't allow it in one that is mixed with console.
ok so, even if people exploit it by getting always the same rng, its the same as a console player restarting the fight over and over again until they get the rng they want. so technically, save states only save you from spending a long time trying to get that rng... idk how is that a problem since save states were always a thing made to save time lol. but if you're that concerned about it, just split the categories.
you already have runs on the board that "abused" save states, so I think the best thing here for you to do is splitting the categories. either that or you remove every existing run lmao. cheers
Alright, so here's what I'm gonna do. i'm a little out of pocket due to RPG Limit Break, but the decision I'm on is 'there will be a board that allows anyone, but the rule is that it has to be contiguous play from character select'. i've proven that char select itself is not fixed RNG, so playing (and retrying normally) after that point is fair no matter the platform. I'm going to put this under the name 'Fastest Victory % No RNG Manip' .
I'm going to create an emulator only category that allows for rapid save stating, as long as your start to end is contiguous, so as to not get in the way of peoples' grind. My current name for it is 'Fastest Victory %'. This matches the general concept of Any% meaning anything goes, and conditionals being put on that. This does not mean that RNG manip is required or expected, just that it is possible and you will never be disqualified from the category for it. (Without requiring you to show more of your run, as in the FV%No RNG, I could never prove if you are or aren't, and neither can anyone else, so everyone goes in the same bucket!)
Conveniently, this means that the board you were already using for emulator Fastest Victory % is valid to submit for again, and is where rapid emulator runs will live! I will create the Fastest Victory % No RNG Manip category for future console and emu enjoyment.
Thanks to Pazuzu and JPTRON for their input, and all of everyone's understsanding. Wu Tang Forever!
