There is an in-game timer that shows on the loading menu that tells you how much time you've spent on the current playthrough of your game. So if you were to start a new game from the last mission it would reset to 0:00:00
Idk exactly how it works, if it includes load times or if it includes failed attempts but if it excludes load times, then this could be a way of getting times without loads, which I feel would be extremely helpful because load times appear to be a lot faster for @StarFalco64 on the gamecube than for my run or @WeaponLord.
The only problem with this is that the timer only tells you the time played in days, hours and minutes but doesn't tell us in seconds
This could be added as a variable on the leaderboards and it could be made a rule that future runs should save the game after the run and check the in-game timer. Of course, real time will still be recorded. It could also be a way to ensure runs aren't spliced
What do you guys think? @f1 As moderator, I'd appreciate your take on this
So I've been testing the timer out
The timer includes
- Any gameplay time (including gameplay prior to quitting to main menu, failed mission attempts and successful mission attempts)
The timer excludes
- Any time on the mission select menu
- Any time on the pause menu
- Any loading times
So with this information in mind, I see no reason not to add it as a variable on the leaderboards. In order to add in-game time, runners will have to save the game after the run and look at the in-game time on the load menu
Reminds me of how the timer works on http://www.speedrun.com/tpps2
That's very convenient! And very inclusive and practical. It allows everyone to get a InGame-timer comparison beetwen runs without concern about different platforms, or reading from a disc or hd. In my case I have a PS2 slim with no hard drive, I use the disc and it's tough. The loading times is really messed on this platform comparing to more simple architectures of its same generation as gamecube or Xbox specially with no hard drive installed (which also includes the factor using an emulator or real hardware)
But this can be a thing only if everyone agrees on. Specially mods. And also comes the question, it will be a variable or to change completely the Leaderboard records if times and rankings turn out to be different than current ones?
I moderate a game that keeps track of both In game and Real time
https://www.speedrun.com/Duke_Nukem_Time_to_Kill#Wussy
But just to show an example, in this case it makes no difference for ranking, because whoever gets faster in Real timer, gets in In game timer as well, It's just a matter of keep tracking.
But when loadings take differences between platforms it really can change ranking, so it's important to keep that in mind.
Over on http://www.speedrun.com/spyrort/ runs are sorted by IGT, with RTA as a supplement. so rankings are based on what the community sees as important. Due to the IGT of this game rounding to the nearest minute, it is not nearly as accurate as you would like for leaderboard comparisons, so it shouldn't be used as the main sorting method.
Yeah the one problem I see with this is that it only rounds to the nearest minute. I still think it should be added.
The thing is, you could calculate in-game time in a run quite easily because the loading between missions seems to be quite consistent for each player between missions i.e. Star Falco's runs have around 15-16 seconds between missions (which includes loading screens and time of the mission select screen) and in the Any% category there are 39 missions so his in-game time should be about 10 minutes lower than his RTA. My run and Weapon Lord's runs have 22-23 seconds between missions so our in-game times should be about 15 minutes lower than our RTA
IGT could be used as the main sorting method but then in cases where runners tie, the IGT of the 2 runs could be calculated quite easily. It's not ideal but I don't think RTA is ideal either when loading times are so different and certain runners are given an advantage over others.
I think IGT should definitely be a variable. Whether it's the main variable? I guess we'll just have to wait and see
This is exactly what Super Metroid started off doing, but when the game got optimized and they couldn't cut a minute off they switched to RTA.
The thing is this game only has a very small number of runners and I think it'll be easy to find out which runner has the best run even in the case that 2 runs have the same IGT. If this game was more popular and had a bunch of runners, then I could see the IGT being more of an issue.
People will be less motivated to run the game if they own the game but only on a console with slower loading times and to get more runners interested I think IGT is preferrable to RTA despite only rounding to the nearest minute. I'm fine with going the route of Super Metroid. If the game gets very optimized at some point in the future, we can switch back to RTA
I just got WR in the Any% category with an RTA time of 1:13:05 and IGT of 1:01!
Star Falco responded on discord
"Hey it's not letting me log in atm but I sign off on it I think it's a good idea However I have no clue what my IGT was in my previous run. I'm gonna be running again probably but for now that'll be a setback for me I don't like that it doesn't count seconds, but I've ran games where the IGT was the primary timer and it also didn't count seconds. So I'm not gonna let that hold me up. I say go for it."
@MysticManiac Wuuuut! Niiice man! I'm gonna watch it right now! Congratulations for the WR!
Thanks! I'm really happy with how the run went! Still improvable but a great run!
Thank you for the suggestion, MysticManiac. I am having trouble figuring out what makes this is an improvement from the current timing method.
How, in your opinion, does this IGT timer make an improvement from RTA? I'm not disregarding it from being a variable or an alternative version of the run time, but it just seems like more work (or an added step) in submitting a run that isn't necessary and doesn't show anything more about the run than the RTA time other than possible miscule differences in load times between different consoles.
The loading differences are actually quite considerable. Like, for an Any% run, I think my load times are about 5 minutes longer than Star Falco's load times throughout the entire run. It puts certain runners at a big disadvantage
I'm not necessarily saying the IGT timer is an improvement because it doesn't include seconds and that's not ideal, but I think it should at the very least be a variable, even if it's not the main variable. It's not really much extra "work" you have to do. All you have to do is check your IGT at the end of the run by saving your game and then checking the IGT on the save/load menu. All the ending cutscenes and the credits are skippable so you can basically go from the last mission to the save menu immediately. Imo IGT and RTA timers are equal
It's not a bad idea. But I meant it's also an extra step when running the game because you have to make the IGT timer visible for the video. How do we know what the IGT timer was for previous runs?
I don't think there's really a need to know IGT for previous existing runs. If you look at my recent run, I have the IGT on the title, in the video description and shown at the end of the run. But if runners forget to show it at the end of their run, it's not a problem if RTA is still considered the main method of timing
Besides, if StarFalco and WeaponLord beat their PBs at some point and show their IGT in the video, then the IGT of their previous runs will be irrelevant anyway
