After reading through this forum and doing a little bit of my own research, I've realized that the loading times for this game vary greatly from player to player. In order to get the optimal loading times you must be playing with the original game on a specific ps2 model. With this game already not having too many runners, I think it may be best to switch to timing runs based off of only the time spent actually in the levels and not in the loading screens to even the playing field for current and future runners who want to stay competitive. I know that Sonic Adventure 2: Battle times their runs in a manner just like the one I have proposed to eliminate the need for specific hardware/versions of the game since there are so many options and variables. I feel like this would be the most inclusive method of timing the runs as no matter what hardware (ps1, ps2, ps3, emu) or version (console, pc) of the game you have, you will be on an even playing field with everyone else. I am not quite sure how difficult it would be to implement something like this, but just wanted to put it out there. I'll post a link to a pastebin where I'll show some of the research I did. https://pastebin.com/czzQXWkx
I appreciate all research. Research is good.
I'm not terribly upset at the idea that the original game is the optimal way to play. That's probably ideal for speedruns in general. Also, timing based on your suggestion sounds like a decent amount of extra work for everybody and I wonder if this game series is worth it, given its current lack of prestige and runners. That being said though, it's always up for discussion and I maintain that the best way to handle any potential changes to the leaderboard is by way of community vote. You are free to make your case, both here and in the TM Discord. Maybe you'll end up showing us a better way, who knows? - https://discord.gg/Sa56qR
I think it'd make sense to present both real and in-game time, but it would have to be up to the runner to keep track of the load times with another timer, possibly in post. It'll be annoying, but considering your logic, it'd be worth it- players don't deserve to be punished over their hardware when it doesn't effect skill.
Showing both timing methods is definitely something we could do. Also, given that there isn't really a IGT in Twisted Metal 2 and the "IGT" that's been suggested is basically loadless times, I wonder if a load remover would be useful, much in the same way that Crash Bandicoot: N. Sane Trilogy times their runs.
Playstation 2 with FDS will almost always be fastest for PS1 games. You can see it in just about every other PS1 speedrunning community. Emulator isn't an accurate way to play the game and in some cases, is banned from speedrunning. This is a very small community so keeping emulator available as an option is a great thing, but if it's slower, it's slower. If you start requiring people to remove the time they took in loads from their runs, your small community will get even smaller. That's just my take on it.
It'd be an easy setup to do IGT if an auto-splitter was made for the PC port...the one no one plays. I feel like it'd be a lot of work to count all the times in game unless someone wouldn't mind counting the frames for verification. I do agree that some are at a disadvantage without a PS2, I'd vouch for separating runs from console and emu but still keep it RTA,
Thanks all for the replies! I really appreciate all the feedback and love seeing that people still care about this game as much as I do. The thing that really got me to make this post was the fact that even though I have the original game, original hardware, and even a ps2 and ps3, I unfortunately don't have the correct ps2 model that produces the fastest loading times (about 5-6 seconds faster per loading screen). Also, even though I choose to do my runs on an emulator (since its much easier for me to record this way), emulation load times also vary wildly for whatever reason. I think separating emulator and console times is a good idea in theory, but even if that is done there will still be large load time inconsistencies in each category as some specific consoles and emulators/computers load faster than others. Even load times within all of the possible ps2 models that someone may own vary tremendously. Plus doing so probably wouldn't look too great considering the obvious lack of runners. But on the other hand, the lack of runners might signal that it isn't worth the extra effort to level out all possible hardware configurations. It just seems like it might spark a bit more competition if everyone were on an equal playing field without having to jump through hoops just to not be at as much as a minute disadvantage straight from the get-go. I'm not sure the easiest way to go about implementing this, but we could all try to collaborate on the discord to find the best solution. I can't speak for others, but at least for me it's very discouraging to know that my times are heavily punished simply because I don't have the correct ps2 model.
While, individual level times would even the playing field, it's already a hassle to verify the time people submit for these games is accurate. Having to go through and make sure every single load screen that the time is correct would add too much work to both the people verifying the run and the people submitting the run. It's a lot easier for someone to want to run this game if all they have to do is sit down and play it. Possibly someone could get an automatic splitter working for the PC version, which would also solve the issue of the god awful PC loading times, but idk anyone in our community that would know how to set that up. So, while it would be nice, I just don't think it'll be beneficial for the Twisted Metal games as they are right now.
@Fadiopeel You don't need any specific PS2. All you need to do is enable fast PS1 disc read speed. The only difference other PS2 models will make is maaaaaybe a second. You have to do this every time you play the game, it doesn't save.
Yeah I run the game on a PS2 slim. You have to set it to fast disc speed every single time. But it isn't such a big deal for me because I don't reset the PS2 when running the game. I like the IGT idea, but it shouldn't be too much of a hassle for runners, it should just be pick-up and play. Otherwise it indeed would be a bit discouraging.
Hey guys, I def agree with a lot of what you guys are saying....My friend Gary and i play on a PS 3 and i noticed a minimum of 20 second difference to the other coop team playing on emulator. I agree we should count from start of the level until it says moving on towards the next level. I also don't think emulation should be allowed as it looks like a completely different game than console. Let me know if you want me to re-time my runs and resubmit them using a new timing method. Thank you for begin responsive and looking out for this small community. Feel free to reach out to me here or on discord.
-James AKA Rongus and Jocabonestone
