I'm interested in running the game a bit more seriously and I would like to post my runs at some point but the runs I do are glitchless. No pseudowave, reverse grapplebeam(catching a grapple block from the wrong side) or the weird elevation interaction for early shinespark. This one might up for debate whether it's a glitch or not but I consider it to be.

I've seen that no major glitch category has been added, which made me hopeful that a no glitch category would be added at some point. I though that if someone showed interest in the category it might be added faster.

I just don't enjoy using glitch nearly as much, but right now even in the no major category I would be quite handicapped.

At first, I would have agreed with you, but I really think it's a tough question to tackle. The more time I spend practicing the pseudo wave, for instance, the less random it feels, and the more I like the route. I haven't practiced some tricks, like early space jump or speed boost yet, but I'm starting to look forward to getting them "figured out" so to speak, and getting used to the new routes.

I'm not a mod, or even a long-time speedrunner, but I could definitely see some downsides to fracturing the community even further. There are already 12 nominal categories as it is. At this point, it seems likely that going completely "glitchless" would cost 15-30 minutes vs the NMG route? Maybe a "developer intended route" or similar category would make sense as a sub-category under all-bosses? Would bomb jumping or early grapple beam be allowed in such a category? I'm honestly not sure, as even my own opinion on routing doesn't seem final.

(super mod voice) No

I also run glitchless. Also still quite casual. I understand that glitches are an important part of speedrunning. But I just don't enjoy using them. That beeing said, I don't think that yet another category should be added. The main problem is to define what a glitch is and what not. Who will review every 2 hour video and check it, update the rules as new glitches and techniques are beeing found? Someone might use WaterBombJump accidentaly. Should their run be disqualified? Even if no time was saved? I think it is just too vague for a solid category.

I currently register my glitchless runs under the "no major glitches" category. In the future I might use the "all bosses category" instead. But it doesn't really matter. I won't ever compete for a top ten ranking regardless of category anyway. So I'm just happy to beat my PB, share my runs and be a part of the community.

I usually run glitchless 100% except for WBJs I also think that pseudo-wave should be considered a major glitch for game skipping reasons. Also, I don't think that early grapple should count as glitched because the developers intended for bombs before Kraid to be a thing.

I do think infinite bomb jumps and early grapple are definitely intended game mechanics as the game highly encourage sequence break. For now perhaps I'll go for All Bosses.

I also agree that fragmenting the community too much isn't good, but glitchess is a very standard category for various game and I don't think adding this one would be too much. After all, there is not as much to discover to decrease the time in such a category and quite a bit of pathing from the other still work.

@Random2478 I don't think Pseudo Wave should be considered a major glitch. It's easy enough to pull off with practice (only the one leading to Space Jump is my least consistent), and is not much different a glitch than the comparable and easy-to-do gate glitch or Mock Ball, from Super Metroid. Sure, Pseudo Wave skips the water boss, but Mock Ball skips Spore Spawn. I think major glitches should be saved for tricks that fundamentally break the game.

It is an interesting category to go Glitchless.

I've done All Bosses and you can shove a lot of time with Pseudo Wave- Early Cloak and Water bomb - Early Ice. So that category is also benefit by glitches.

It should be discussed by the community.

I'm all for adding a meme button next to the "Any/100/0/All Bosses" that has whatever other category people want to run. But that would require another poll of what kind of categories people even want to put there.

I also think that in addition to 0% we should have Least Items. Same thing for 100%, we should have a Most Items category.

What's the difference between 0% and Least Items? Considering that percentage tracks item pickup (not powers), then wouldn't they be the same thing? And same for 100% vs. Most Items, what's the difference?

0% only has to skip Energy/Missile/PB Tanks, since that's all the game defines it as. Least Items would require also skipping every upgrade that can be skipped.

The other thing about Glitchless is that Glitchless runs still fit into pretty much all of the other versions. It's just harder to tell where your closest contemporaries are. I imagine we'll have a category extensions or something in the future where people can make whatever categories they want.

There seems to be no other category derived from "glitchless any%". I'm planning and practicing to run "glitchless 0%"(not NMG 0%) speedrun. Is it not suitable category for this community?

Glitchless any % only cuts out a single chozo. Not significant enough to be a category. There wasn't any interest in 0% glitchless as far as I am aware, but doesn't mean you can't run what you like. There were a group of players running glitchless prior to it being a category. Tracked records through a google doc.

I'm for it.

Making the rule clear for that category seem rather easy. The "no Major Glitch" rule establish that what is forbidden are: -Shine Sink Clip -Ledge Warp -Camera Lock -Invincibility -Axis Skew But allow: -Pseudo Wave -Reverse Grapple -Water Bomb Jump

For a glitchless run, simply forbid -Pseudo Wave -Reverse Grapple -Water Bomb Jump Too.

I guess some would argue that Water Bomb Jump should not count as a glitch, but I think it's fair to say it was not intended by the game-designers and I think it makes sense that a "glitchless" run would be to not use any trick not intended by the devs, by definition.

How about Melee Wall Climbing in Cataris？ This trick seems not intended and affects time a lot. Now I think that this trick must be restricted in glitchless category. (at once because someone may submit runs using it)

Also, Melee aiming at Raven Beak should be discussed. I think so many runs have been done after it had been discovered, so it is difficult to restrict it.

Glitchless is defined how GUIGUI_ has laid out, correct. ADM skip (Melee Wall Climbing) and Raven Beak melee aiming are allowed, gold skip is also allowed. Please see https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1oLKeyIfmjRw6r7m4TmQcA0Ski9EHvoBb4A4DUwPMkpo/edit?usp=sharing (under the Rules tab) for more information.

thanks. I didn't know the community is on discord.