I think it's either the bounce off the koopa on vine block platform or the second set of bros pattern, That can be used to determine the bounce. Also hitting the poison mushroom before second set bros. Has some effect?

I usually can make bounce work, When I first started I mostly went for under the platform. With the slightly faster wall jump it is typically fast enough. Backwards wall jump would be even faster.

Better to go top route, I find releasing R on the jump to the middle koopa then pressing when I hit helps? Just kind of superstitious inputs, Still miss it plenty.

Do I just edit too much or anyone else seeing this problem too?

I guess it does save them, Some times it just takes upwards of 10 minutes to update it.

Perhaps a kind TAS user can shed some light on this. When I first did attempts of the C-1 clips on the left side of the pipe, I got down the pipe with 391. Those times I recall jumping from frame 84, 88, and 94. I did crouch jumps.

Now no matter how hard I try I can not get anything faster than 390. Was hoping someone who likes to tinker with TAS could shed some light on why those few clips were faster.

Of course doesn't have to be a TAS. Anyone who could explain how to do it that fast would work too.

Using the koopa on the start screen, Time it so you start on rule 13, This is more to affect A-3 another flag despawn, I believe.

Fastest way to vine block is wall jump, Kosmic I believe uses a full jump ( off WJP ) to get the set up. I don't and still get the set up, May be a few frames faster. Trial and error again you will learn to recognize the hammer bro patterns that work. For the bros go middle route.

After this on the pyramid like structure there is an option to manipulate the next set of bros. Either down +R or just down seems to work? There are ways to do the wall jump so you do not need this. Those are recommended. If you feel the need to do this, it's on the last stair type block on the right. Trial and error again.

Next, on the second set of bros. You again learn the patterns that work. You must bop the bro(s) to the right. Only the bro(s) that are on the middle platform. Now there will only be 2 koopas if you have the set up. Bonk the second koopa. This will despawn the spring.

From where the spring should be, Bonk and kick the koopa under the coin block to the left.

Finally the stairs. Here coin toss comes into play? Again trial and error.

I was fooling around with this level there is a FR save over WR. A good fast accel would make it easier but can be done without. Backwards wall jump on vine block platform.

And on that bombshell, Learning a method for backwards wall jump with no accel that gets the set up. Is probably a good idea, Some times going under the platform is too slow. With backwards wall jump, it isn't. I haven't really tried it but it is probably just as easy.

Probably watch Kosmic or who ever else runs this to learn what to do? Hitting the vine block is part of the set up for flag despawn.

That doesn't really address your issue though. It really is a pain in the butt I have no idea how to do it consistently.

Just trial and error and even then I often restart until I get the good bounce. More often than not, You can bounce to the platform.

However, Some times it seems impossible and you have to go under the platform. There may be a way to tell which bounce you are going to get but I haven't understood that aspect of the despawn set up.

If you would like, I can try and explain the flag despawn set up.

May have seen this mentioned in Niftski's chat on one of his records.

Partial goomba skip, I do believe this is what it's called. If you do a backwards jump and then add another jump after stomping the goomba, It seems to save a frame rule. Can get 346 to the warp room. and 354 to the flagpole.

Never knew about it. This game deserves more love why so little? It's oodles of fun.

Thanks that's a great help, I was going to try TAS but it's not something I'm familiar with.

I did notice it might be possible to clip a block lower, bouncing off the koopa. Maybe I'll try TAS and experiment with that.

Another 4-2 question, Clipping into the pipe just before the one we go down. Under the blue bricks in the middle. Is it possible to do that fast enough to be useful?

I basically spent the day figuring out how to clip there, I'm getting faster at it, but it's still slow. I figure there must be a way to clip there that is as fast as blazit?

Learning to do blazit now, Thanks.

Question about saving the additional frame rule. With slow motion and save states, I am able to enter the warp pipe 355 R18. Time 25.60.

How many frames faster does it need to be to save the frame rule?

I think I just realized it, Each game second has 2 frame rules? So I got R18 on the slower rule. I need 14 or 15 more frames to save the additional frame rule?

Backwards jump into the last pit, WJP(1bump) - Up and hit the upper brick platform corner. (2bump)

These give an x position of 130 or 131. Is it possible to get 132?

Also, Even if you can only get 130 or 131, Is it possible to get the 3rd tiny bump without losing too much time?

Feel like I have gotten lower with a 3rd (not sure) but last I remember was 25.80. Think that is about standard for 3 bump?

Periwinkle! Thanks. I think I understand now!

4:58.5 Seems to be the time when I subtract 9. Not 100% sure. Is just BBG enough for that time?

TLDR messed up framerule offset

Have been using Fceux emulator save states, Practicing / learning to run on the Pellsson rom. According to Somewes' Bowser pattern website -

I got a 4:55.43, However no FPG no 1-2 or 4-2 clip. Only trick was BBG. I did have pizza but no coke /HAHA sorry I know.. I had to though, I shouldn't have.

Something about that just doesn't make sense? Shouldn't those tricks be necessary for 4:55? Am I just 'bragging' about a save state run?

Still I don't get it. Any run with that time I've seen uses multiple FPG and both those clips. Even some fast accels.

What's the deal? You're the only people who would know. Possibility I realized just now, Maybe I messed up the frame rule offset. I am trying to recreate it. Either way I'm still curious if such a time is possible without all those tricks?

I'm new but what has worked for me is, Jumping off the pipe to WJ pixel. I was unable to ever hit it the normal way.

Something else I just started fooling around with is, Not holding R when I jump, Then resuming holding R during the jump.

Don't know if it's just me but it seems to hit the pixel more often.