From the rules:

Allowed emulators are as listed: Mednafen, Xebra and ePSXe 1.9.0/1.9.25/2.0 Please note 2.0.2 and subsequently overclocking are not allowed General Submission Rules: http://www.speedrun.com/spyro/thread/j13wg

I don't have all too much else to say right now, but I'm damn looking forward to seeing a run B) Best of luck.

Hey EpicNess! To try to resemble your grace in your (really interesting!) post, I feel the first thing I should say is: welcome! It's exceedingly rare nowadays to see someone working on a speedgame for such a long time without reaching out to people; not that there are many to reach out to, heh.

I've asked the board mods to move this post into a new thread, since this isn't all too relevant to the rule clarifications. We can't "move" the post to a new thread, so you'll see your post as saying it's by AlexDest. Apologies.

I'm sure Alex and KJ would be more than happy to get Any% NG+ on the boards. The one thing we will ask, however, is video evidence. For the fastest time in any category, it's preferable to have proof. Not only for our own safeguarding, but also for the perspectives of people straying to the boards. I'm sure you understand.

By way of contact, the easiest (and largely only way) to really get hold of myself is through a program called Discord. It's like Skype but designed for gamers, and a large chunk of the runners for Spyro/Crash games, and the board mods, can be contacted. If you have a Twitch account, send me a PM and I can hit you up with an invite link that you can use to gain access to the server. You'll also be able to talk one-on-one with myself and the mods.

So, I guess I need to give a little confession:

Back in the summer, as an act against the fact that no Spyro games got into the speedrunning marathon Summer Games Done Quick, which you may be familiar of, the Spyro community set up a "showcase" - our own little marathon involving all the categories we could get runners for. I simply picked up Eternal Night to fill a gap in the series for what became known as the "Spyrothon". I got a 2:57 and the run was filled with mistakes and restream issues. My knowledge and skill in Eternal Night is minimal. I've played the game like 5 times. If you've seen my run, you'll know - it's pretty bad. I picked up on semi-optimal things to be doing here and there, but I feel it's a bit empty, as far as runs go. It was more "playing the game fast" than "speedrunning". I definitely didn't get as far as OoB tricks. Does that make sense?

Referring to the "new run" reference: the latest time on the boards isn't actually new. The mod team had only just got around to sorting out the console subcategories (differentiation between versions), so it's actually the same run, just resubmitted. For the love of God, don't watch it.

When I first saw your post come in, I was a little scared, if I'm honest. I felt as though by being "the" image of the game, I'd set up expectations. I feel like I've let you down.

But I must say - I dropped the post in the Spyro Discord, and loads of guys were really, really impressed. You've done an excellent job in developing legitimate speedtech in this game. It might make a dull game a lot more fun, both to watch and play. Your work is highly commendable, and we applaud you for it. I'll throw eloquence to the side for a sec while I say: "That's fucking sick."

You've probably guessed by now, but I don't actively run this game. I don't actually run - or even play - anything. Unfortunately, it is real life circumstances that lead to that being the case, so I can't promise I'll be active with the game soon, if ever. I may even be taking my final bow in the community soon.

I hope all of this doesn't come as too much of a letdown. But I must reiterate: you've done a sterling job, and i imagine that this cool speedtech could bring in more interest and competition to the game (I'm looking at you, Dustiel). I'm afraid I don't have much to give you, but I will be more than happy to speak with you about the game, bounce off ideas, and help you if I can in any way.

Thanks for all your effort. Keep it up.

~Xen0va

As a more serious response:

"It is impossible to get the world record on emulator and the emulator has a big disadvantage over console."

I struggle to subscribe to the idea of "you can't get the best time, so it doesn't matter". WR is just another run that happens to be faster than other known times. As an entity, WRs and non-WRs aren't - and shouldn't be - distinguishable by way of treatment and attitudes, in my opinion.

I've made this evident in the past, but I like the idea of having a "standard" for emulators. That is, emulators are banned unless stated otherwise; not the other way around. If there are variations in emulators, the actual credibility of runs blur - there are just too many variables.

I refer to my previous paragraph when considering the newest ePSXe version: "emulators are banned unless stated otherwise". We don't know enough about how it behaves. I believe it should be unbanned if and when we have credible evidence that it's fit for use and comparable to the other accepted emulators. Load times aren't the only factor to consider. There are likely variables between emulators we haven't even thought about.

And of course, the classic argument: we're emulating PS1; not PS2, PS3, or Vita. I know people are torn, and I can see both sides, but I believe the emulator should be comparable to the console it wishes to imitate, not what happens to be the fastest console.

imo

Thank God, we've been running low on shitty meme threads lately.

According to SRL, VBA-M is banned for all GBA games for their races. I'm not sure how this translates to this game, I don't run it, but I imagine that at the least, VBA will be fine. It's a widely used and generally accepted emulator in most circumstances. I'm sure a mod will correct me if I'm wrong, but I'd go with VBA for now.

I. Run Definitions "Any%" is defined as beating the game as fast as possible with no restrictions. No collectibles or upgrades are required.

"100%" is defined as beating the game as fast as possible, having collected all 40 Scriber's Quills, 5 Health Relics, and 5 Magic Relics. Element upgrades are not required.

II. Timing

This game is timed using the "RTA" timing convention, which is somewhat unique for Spyro runs. This means that timing begins on the final menu input and ends when the player loses control. In this case, timing should start when the player selects "Press square to continue without saving" if not using a memory card, or on the screen with "Press X to continue" if one is being used. Timing ends after pressing R2 to perform "Dark Fury" on Gaul. You need not wait for cutscenes to play out.

In the event that SDA timing is used for a run, 2:17 should be added to the final time.

The reason for this discrepancy over the regular pattern is because control is gained in a half-second period in which the screen is black.

III. Emulator Usage

Emulators are not permitted for the PS2 version of this game. My observations when testing The Eternal Night on PCSX2 question the accuracy of the game's emulation. Input lag was noticeable and severe, and sacrificed the eligibility of the combat sections.

IV. Use of Alternate Platforms

You are now able to submit runs on the game's other platforms. Please select the version you use when submitting a run, and it will be sorted into that console's subcategory. Normal submission rules apply (see below).

All other submission rules (as found here http://www.speedrun.com/tlos2/thread/t0zsf) apply unless directly conflicted by a claim made on this post.

I was just on the verge of forgetting. Thanks Jumpy.

OMGScoots

Fair point. I'll just offer a counter argument, for the sake of balance.

Speedruns should be about fun. That's why we do them, right? But human instinct means we have made it competitive, with the "ultimate goal" being getting the WR. So, the way they should be ranked is by skill, right?

The speedrunning community should encourage people to join and treat them all equally: giving them equal chances to do well in these rankings.

The run with the most skill was by Shaw, who is a runner who has been denied a WR because he does not have the funds/access to an American console. It seems apparent then that the leaderboards are not ranking players by skill, but by a combination of skill and "luck", luck denoting ability to access hardware.

FDS not being used for the sake of one person is somewhat "special treatment". There are, and will be in the future, runners who do not have access to FDS, and this respect should surely outreach to those people as well. It goes back to the idea of equality within the community, as much as it may seem like a child's response (in fact, it is), it is still valid that runners should be given equal opportunities.

Let me know what you think.

~ Hero

I'll give some of the major arguments:

Ty made a very good point about this earlier: using FDS has not improved the degree to which you have played the game, it has just given you an advantage that some people can't compare to. There can be some really skilled players out there, why should they lose the chance of a WR if they don't have the necessary hardware to run FDS of a category? ¤cough¤ Shaw ¤cough¤

Perhaps FDS should be used in PAL to make it more comparable to NTSC SDS (gotta love that European hardware), but there should not be a difference so large in loading times such that it would need to be a factor considering when deciding on the best run of a game. Jumpy's time in this category is considered the WR, but is actually the third best run people have achieved.

The other side of the argument is that the PS2 is official hardware, so there should be no reason to not be able to use it. A speedrun is based on the idea of running a game as fast as possible within the limitations of a category's description. This would demonstrate that FDS should be used - it is an official strategy to speed up the game.

Just some food for thought. There is a lot more depth that could be gotten into, should ePSXe 1.8 be legal, for example. But I'll leave it at that for now OpieOP

~ Hero