Hello RE community

I would like to talk about rules & moderation with you I m an old RE runner and always fight for fair and legit way to speedrun together.

• 120 FPS : Should be atleast 60 / Variable option cause it's ingame option + should be separate categories. If the community real want 120 (i m not), should be separate too

• Resolution/Graphics : Changing it DURING the run should be not even a question. The run should be as clean as possible and options should be chosen BEFORE the run to not affect the game/display/etc. This rule should not even exist if 120 FPS rule were not there.

• OOB : Should be named Major Glitch / No Major glitch and should also be a subcategory to have true any%. I don't like how OOB broke the game but we just cannot hide the fastest way to do the game

It s a mess ... i m sorry but it's true ! That's an EXEMPLE how it should be https://www.speedrun.com/Umbrella_Corps/full_game#PC_NG

A part of current moderators are doing rules without ask to the real community + Some are really cocky during stream (vocal) or private chat. Yes i m clearly asking to clean moderators of this game and come back to basic StevenMayte/Darazanjoll/Soulless/Zecc to change everything.

I m sorry, i don't like drama but A LOT OF PEOPLE agree with what i m saying and ask to change everyday. So i ask to all RE runner to read this and change stuff RIGHT NOW ;)

My last post about the board can be ready here: https://www.speedrun.com/re2remake/thread/oefcq/9

I made an example on how things can be fixed on the UC board and I wanna explain it.

Tabs: Hardware and NG/NG+ PC and Console are placed as tabs so we can make exclusive sub categories for them. Framerate will for example only be displayed on the PC tabs and not on the Console tab. As for difficulties you will only have Standard and Hardcore for the NG tabs and no subcategory for NG+ since assisted is only allowed.

PC (NG) explained: Subcategory1: Scenarios Subcategory2: Difficulty Subcategory3: Framerate. 60 (most runners can achive a stable 60 fps which will make this the most fair category, it wont be hardware dependent. 120 (I never agreed to accept 120 and people can read the reasons for this in the post i linked above, it is however too late now to remove it.) Unlocked (People who have the hardware and dont wanna use Major Glitches can push the game to its limit) Subcategory4: Glitches. (No Major Glitches (these will have to be defined in the rules) and Major Glitches for OoB, item duping etc.

I am well aware that this leaderboard setup isnt the most beautiful one but it solves pretty much EVERYTHING that people have problems with.

As I said in my post, these things needs to be solved NOW, yesterday would be even better. The longer we wait the harder it will be to get things in order.

Lastly I wanna point out this ridicouls thing about pausing the game in order to lower ones graphic settings to achive a higher fps. Just run the game on low from the very beginning.

Hello !

i don't understand a lot of things with RE2R's leaderboard on PC. Why all of this arbitrary choice...

_-"All runs need game audio, if your run has portions muted due to copyright music your run will be rejected. Music also must not overpower the game audio."

• I don't understand what's the problem ? if someone wants to record his run with a smartphone or something like this, whithout sound or a bad audio, his run is not legit ? Cheat Hunting is not a good argument for this...

_-"Extended periods of time spent in the pause screen will also invalidate a run."

*So what happened with Roofress's run (Claire A Console and a really good run) ? He paused the game something like 1min, his run was accepted ? and other runs can be cancel ? This rule is useless for a leaderboard.

_-"60fps and 120fps needs to be displayed during the run. You can activate this in "Steam > Settings > in-game > in-game. See forums for alternative suggestions"

*So... why the main category of this game should be in 120fps ? and not 180 or 160 or... 116,5 ? And why 60fps are in the same leaderboard than 120fps ? This choice is clearly only because it serves some people.

_-Changing Resolution or image quality is only allowed during boss fights

*This is the worst rule... i'm not a big fan of changing image quality or other during a run... this is my opinion. But "only allowed during boss fights" ? What's wrong whith you guys ?

I'm sorry if my english is too bad or if i'm too rude but a lot of this rules are bullshit, and this is why a lot of people don't want to submit his runs in SR.com. I hope it will change, because at the moment it's a mess.

Rude but true

IMO Seph & Darazanjoll & 1TLAU are right for me.

U cant do a simple cat with 60 & 120 FPS ATM cause of knife's dmg. Ppl have to run the same FPS mode so 60 FPS. If they want to run 120 or more they have to post it in a no major glitch.

I agree with this leaderboard proposal but I feel like unlocked & MG would be better as misc categories since it probably wouldn't be popular in comparison to 60 and 120. If it did become active which is highly unlikely then I'd say it deserves a spot outside of misc

Hey guys,

First, thanks for the feedback on this. I'm going to mainly address SephJul's post in this, with some other points splashed in afterward.

FPS: 120 is also an option if the player has a monitor that supports it. I'm down for splitting things up in the future. We have always said that the current state of running it all together is not necessarily permanent. At the time, we felt it was best to just find a temporary middle ground that kept the leaderboards clean, and then branch the filters into different categories later if we felt this was best. Doing this, the FPS with the most runs would be the default display if we split things into official categories.

Resolution: T his is one thing I advocated for, because a ton of other speed games allow this at certain points. It might be new to some people in the Resident Evil series, but the mods allowed this in 7 to achieve higher frame rate due to the 1 hit Mia bug (works similar to the knife, more on that below).

OoB: This is a good idea, and I want to talk to the other moderators about their thoughts on this.

UC's leaderboards: yeah that's a mess. But it's more fair in the context of what you're talking about. I have several ideas for how we would do a split while trying to keep it clean. Maybe we can get a test board and try out various ideas -- if we went that route.

The moderators: This was actually addressed yesterday in this thread: https://www.speedrun.com/post/n2as1

To summarize, we had a moderator that launched a category with haste, and included a rule that most of the community did not agree with. This rule essentially killed the category for most runners interested in it. I agree, the community should give feedback on category suggestions and their rulings. It shouldn't be someone jumping in and deciding rules just because they think it's best. That's why I made that topic the big discussion of the day for the moderators yesterday, because clearly that setup wasn't working out.

A for the rest of what you said (regarding being "cocky during stream (vocal) or private chat") - I'm not really sure what to say about this. Two of our mods you want on your team are currently on the team. I've not witnessed anybody being cocky to anyone. I question if this is something lost in translation? I'll take your word for it that someone personally offended you though, and I apologize if that did happen.

Game audio: We have never flat out banned music from being in a stream. We have said that audio can not overpower game audio (to the point it becomes hard to detect game audio). There's several logical reasons for this, and it carried over from RE7's leaderboards. You can have music, the moderators just need to be able to hear all game audio at all times. From that point, it's up to the runner to take the risk of their audio being muted/VOD removed due to copyright.

Pausing: We've stated many times publicly that "a minute or two is fine" -- any further is grounds for rejection. Life happens. If you have an emergency and need to pause, that's fine. But no, we're not going to let you pause and watch WR, or pause and go grocery shopping (this actually happened in another game). One of you brought up Roo's pause for a minute for one game, which was fine, and another of you brought up a drastically different example as if against it entirely. This is an example of how we can't make everyone happy when it comes to this rule.

In my honest opinion, I've had no problem with the moderation at any stage. Runs have been verified quickly. The first run I submitted was my mistake (Variable, confusing ANY on the filter with Any/Variable Frame Rate) and that was rejected but in a professional manner

With regards to removing/changing categories, I'm against that. The board looks fine to me. Having 120 over variable is much more viable, because it stops people abusing the frame rate to get a faster time. Using the Variables in speedrun.com allows people to use a filter to separate the categories without the need of creating multiple lines for separate categories.

With regards to changing the graphics mid run, i don't see that as a problem either (Disclaimer, i DO NOT change the graphics mid run) Not allowing that is would be preventing people who want to run 120 but get lower frame rate during boss fights from running the category.

With regards to this being the optimal layout - https://www.speedrun.com/Umbrella_Corps/full_game#PC_NG

Looks like spaghetti junction if i'm honest. Too much going on and creates too many" WR's " and confusion for peoples audiences when describing who has what WR

I also wanted to include the fact that 120 has 3 times as many runs submitted than 60FPS on Leon A alone

Also me and several other runners have had to sit through the frame rate being capped to 120 and making all of our hard work and runs invalid, and now it is being suggested to add it again and potentially remove 120 is just kinda dumb.

TL:DR - It's fine the way it is

Changing graphics settings etc, mid run makes this game less appealing as a speed game, especially to the classic RE community. Why do we want the main category to be about switching graphics settings and knifing bosses? Wouldn't it be more interesting to route in gun/ammo pickups instead and also at the same time have it a completely level playing field? 60FPS is the way to go!! Also, with regards to losing hard work, this game is so new that you can't expect it to stay the same as it is now. Anyone running it this early should know going in that it's subject to change and shouldn't be upset about any kind of "lost work."

That's a little bias, the games only been out two weeks, this is what you should expect from a new game like this. I don't think critisism as to the way the rules and leader board are being handled should be dismissed just because its how it has been the last 2 weeks. Rules as to how games are run change a lot, especially during the first few months of a game. Tl;Dr - its still early days and rules are subject to change. It even says it at the bottom of the rules. If your run is invalidated because of it, brush it off and keep running.

@WitchRain Personally, I hate the knife in this game. I wish it would be patched to not be broken. It would resolve a lot of issues. It might invalidate some WR's and change routing, but that's the nature of running a game early.

That being said, I vouched for allowing it for the current state of the rules (which of course is going to change) just to make 120 fps more viable to more runners. There's a chance that all those runs are going to turn around and change in the future.

Is changing graphics mid-run ideal? No. But it was mostly allowed as an attempt to lower entry into 120 for the time being.

@mondomantra you're right in that the rules are not set in stone yet. That's part of the reason we're just allowing it all right now. I personally hope that the knife is nerfed on Friday. I don't think it will be, but I would be thrilled if they adjusted it.

I don't know if I necessarily agree with the argument about "top runners dictating" anything -- I think a lot of people play this game uncapped in general. Most of the complaints we got, when we initially segregated the boards by FPS, weren't even from top runners. I mean we did get complaints from top runners too, I won't lie, but even people not on the boards yet were complaining about being forced to play at over half the frame rate their GPU could push out.

120 was the number chosen for a few reasons. One of them being that most runners playing uncapped (variable/v-sync off) could get beyond 120 on average. Second, the damage multiplier (or whatever you really want to call it in this context) sees the most benefit once you start to hit 120. We wanted to limit it there to prevent it from getting any crazier than necessary.

Anyway, ideally I would much rather the knife be nerfed and then we move runs using the strat elsewhere to preserve them. I don't like what the knife has done to this game. I don't think it will be patched, but I really am keeping my fingers crossed.

I honestly agree with Trance in that the way the game has been moderated recently has been just fine. The board looks great compared to how it was Day 1. I was initially against separating the boards, but now as the times begin to become more and more distant of each other, I'd probably be in favor of making different subcategories for 60 and 120, just to give some attention to 60 and to motivate more people to run it over 120 if their rigs aren't powerful enough to run the game above that framerate (though 120 should probably still be the main category out of sheer popularity).

That said I'm becoming tired of the people complaining about 120 and asking why it isn't just "Variable." The reason I'm frustrated is because I feel a lot of arguments here are coming out of ignorance or people who are just salty about knife strats. Variable means the game would run at whatever your rig can handle, whether that be 70FPS, or 300+. A Variable category would make the category almost completely pay-to-win, as the competition would come down to who owns the best GPU/CPU, meanwhile an agreed upon cap like 120, which is achievable for many, allows us to use higher FPS strats without worrying about our GPUs not being good enough to compete. It's been tested extensively, and there is no cap to knife damage, it keeps scaling along with your FPS. Someone at 300+ FPS is just going to be doing more damage compared to someone who's running the game at 150FPS.

And to come back to those who are upset about the knife being so meta in the game: I'm sorry, but that's just the way it is. It's speedrunning, we use what's good and fast, and the knife is absurdly good on BOTH 60FPS and 120FPS, and is just faster to use and pick up compared to most other items/weapons. If that upsets you, then I'm sorry to sound rude, but this probably won't be a speedrun that interests you then. No one complains in RE4 that we use the rocket launcher to one-shot all but three bosses since it's so OP and cheap for what you get out of it, as it's what's fastest.

Also why is lowering graphics mid-run such a hot topic now? I don't understand how people can be opposed to this, as all it does is make the 120FPS category more accessible? Like what's the issue with making a category more accessible? People don't want to run the game at 400p the entire run when it only matters for small segments? This isn't giving anyone an edge or slowing down the run drastically by any means, it's just people taking like <30 seconds to change some settings so they can perform their strats before going back to normal.

Also the rule for audio is common practice in many games as to avoid people splicing runs. The rules on this as-is are completely reasonable IMO.

So to top it off: separation via subcategories for 60 and 120FPS should DEFINITELY be considered, as I do think it's warranted at this point and would give people more motivation to run 60FPS instead of feeling bad about not being able to compete with those at 120FPS. But saying shit like 120 just being Variable or unironically saying that 120 just be removed and forcing everyone to run at 60? Just idiotic.

I don’t post on the forums very often, but this is one where I simply must share my thoughts.

FPS: This has been discussed countless times. I, and other mods, have explained that things are subject to change. Making 60 and 120 their own category isn’t just off of the table because it isn’t implemented every time someone makes a forum post whining about it. You are extremely impatient, and completely unaware of how much thought we’ve put into this. Be patient, and we’ll get to it eventually. There’s even a Variable setup for easier implementation in the future.

Changing Res/Graphics: There are quite a few people who would love to run at 120, but there CPU/GPUs run a bit short to do the Knife Strats optimally on boss fights. It takes about 10 seconds to change settings and let’s those runners compete against other 120 runs. The WR for Claire A Standard is a great example. I see no problem with this at all, especially since this is PC. Many other games, including RE7, allow this.

OoB: The OoB run, despite being the “true any%”, completely throws away the greatest things about RE speedrunning, and survival horror in general. It’s no surprise that people would rather run the normal categories. It will remain the way it is, and does not need to be messed with. If people want to skip most of the game, then they can. A category doesn’t need to be a main category, or even be on the LB for people to run it. People were running Knife Only before we even added it to the Extensions.

Now for the Rules that TLAU asked about.

Audio: YES, you need distinguishable audio for your run. This is almost like an unwritten law in speedrunning that should be upheld. We don’t want to hear your spotify playlist, and we don’t want your vids muted. Is clean game audio really so much to ask for?

Pausing: Pausing for a couple of minutes to go to the bathroom or quickly let your dog/cat out of the room or outside is totally fine. Answer an important phone call or talk to a family member that needs your attention. As long as its only a couple of minutes, it’s fine. That rule is there because it lets people not piss themselves or let their animal piss themselves for the sake of beating a game fast. If you decide to pause your game for 20 minutes to make food, watch TV, and do laundry... yeah, that’s clearly a rejection.

Display FPS: This is needed for us to verify that Variable framerate isn’t being used, or that someone is running over 60 under the 60 Variable. 120 is a good mid-ground framerate. It’s double the amount of 60, but not set so high that people can achieve it without major PC/Monitor upgrades. If you want to run a higher FPS, then do it. We won’t accept it here, but that doesn’t mean you can’t do it and post it online or something.

RES/Graphics: Yes, we allow it because if you want to run 120 and don’t have steady 120 in boss fights, that leads to not being able to do the optimal fights. Nobody seems to need to change these options for anything other than boss fights, so that’s why it says that.

Everyone is up in arms about so much of this stuff, and a lot of the people who have the most to say, seem to have no intention of running the game if things don’t go there way. That’s a terrible mindset to have. YOU’RE ruining the experience for yourself, not us mods. Run the game and enjoy it, despite not agreeing with everything in the first couple weeks after it’s release. Ya know, instead of going wild in the forum threads.

Also... Sephjul, nothing against you, but that last accusation of moderators being “cocky” and vocal, and you wanting us to be removed, is absolutely ridiculous. We’re doing the best we can and it’s extremely ungrateful for you to throw our work aside like that. Your words do not go unnoticed, but try to be respectful to the people who have worked on this, instead of making huge whiny forum posts saying those hard working people should be tossed aside.

That’s about all I have to say on these matters. Some of you may not like what I’ve said, and that’s fine. Just know that we have been working hard since day one, and we DO want what’s best. These things take time and we just hoped people would be patient with this. Not everyone will agree with each other, but please don’t let that stop you from enjoying and running the game. I hope you understand.

I have no problem with the moderation, but I mean expecting the rules not to change and old wrs to become invalid is just wishful thinking. Capcom could release a patch tomorrow to fix the knifes damage and bam, every run on the board now becomes oldpatch%.

If the knife will be fix Friday, speedrunners will play in a downgrade version of the game. Knife strats is not a problem. We don't care about p2w stuff,... It looks like you're scare to play 120fps if it's not the "main category".

If we don't talk about FPS, a lot of rules are bad and if nobody can see the problem with "Changing Resolution or image quality is only allowed during boss fights" i don't know what to say. Why it is allow only during boss fight ? if i do this in the Police station my run is not legit ? Why ?

For "Extended periods of time spent in the pause screen will also invalidate a run" "I don't know, maybe less than 5min is fine." is not a answer, this is not how we do rules.

The rules are not good at all, i'm speechless.

It feels like you're newbies in speedrun and i'm pretty sure you're not. I'm really suprised about all of this bad decisions. Anyway...

Rules are not respected after all.

@Jayzorblade If against all odds, Capcom did patch the knife, we would definitely have a community discussion as to what to do with the old runs. Personally, I'm for preserving them in some way - even if it's a sub-category on the extensions or something. Here's to hoping, but I doubt it, just based on the fact it seems so engine-level based.

@1TLAU we've clarified several times, twice in this thread alone that 2 minutes is fine. We have one person even pointing out that Roo's run in a very old game is allowed to pause - and then you seem to be against it entirely. I can accept that you don't like this ruling, but we have stated a max several times. We've never said "idk maybe less than 5min is fine" -- you're putting words in our mouths at this point. As for the rest of your complaints, and how you're claiming we're newbies, it doesn't seem like you have a huge run history in games on the PC platform where most of your complaints are norms in PC speedrunning. If the knife gets patched on Friday, it's going to be a discussion with the community if we allow downgrading. But I personally don't think that would be acceptable.

@CursedToast in the divinity 2 speed run board they separate the runs by patch. Old patch and current patch. I'd imagine something like that would do.

I said Roo's run is awesome, no problem with this. I had no problem with a pause in a speedrun if it's single segment and IGT. (i'm just not a big fan)

But i talked about rules, and when i read ""Extended periods of time spent in the pause screen will also invalidate a run"... it's not a real rule.

If someone pause 2m10s, it will be reject ? 1m59 is fine ? "idk maybe less than 5min is fine" and "idk maybe less than 2min is fine" is the exact same problem.