Small addendum to the ruleset: surviving death triggers via the interaction invincibility, for example at the oil tank in Louvre Storm Drains, is not allowed. Any other scenario with interaction invincibility is still considered fine for glitchless.
This doesn't change the current route in any way, it's just for clearing up the situation.
I gave an attempt at fixing the load remover, here's the link: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1DLKZFukUa25jcYeV6kufc3l5MKP-Vr5r/view?usp=sharing
I tested it at the first few loading screens of the game, seemed to work fine on my PC. But I'm using a different variable for load removal, so loading durations might be different from what the currently used script times. So the moderators' approval would definitely be needed if the new script was to be used in actual runs.
I won't, sorry. I have some issues with IL runs:
- Most of the runs would either consist of taking a few steps then bonking into something to finish the level, or spamming moonjumps. Runs like these would not make a worthwhile watch imo.
- How do you speedrun levels like Willowtree Herbalist or Parisian Ghetto? Why would you do an IL speedrun of Margot Carvier's Apartment?
I'd like to address a statement from one of my previous posts: "However, this is definitely not a trigger bug. The trigger bug comes from the broken coordinate calculation in the P3 executable, which causes Lara's meshes to stretch across triggers on the map. You can see the stretching when Lara disappears for a frame or two." This is incorrect. I explain why here: https://pastebin.com/r1aJScgc - but still, the PBS end trick is not a trigger bug, since it doesn't trigger everything on the map.
A different thing I wanted to bring up: in Aquatic Research Area there is a bug with the turrets not spawning occasionally. I'd like to include a note into the rules that for a valid run you need to shoot the box near them no matter if the turrets are there or not. If you're fine with this, like the post, if not, discuss as usual.
Notice that the PBS ending trigger trick is possible on any version of the game, while wall-hug interaction doesn't work on v52. Also take into account that you can pick up an item with wall-hug interaction in Von Croy's Apartment which will result in Lara clipping through collision, so that definitely should exclude this trick from glitchless runs.
I personally draw the line at the action button: do you need to press it for getting that thing (trigger, pickup) on the other side of the wall? If yes, then we should consider the trick a glitch.
Thanks for your input, I feel I've worded the rule on that a bit vaguely.
I've updated the glitchless rulesets on both the segmented and the RTA boards. If you have some time, please check one of them out. Please tell me if you think that something is still not clear or I've forgotten something: I've tried to clear out weird jargon from the ruleset so it's easy to read, and I hope every possible scenario that can arise in a glitchless run is covered. And as we previously agreed upon regarding the Strahov railing clip, I've placed a small text to these runs:
Some time has passed, and Techqua has discovered new things. So I'd add the following things to the rules:
-
Interacting with objects by wall-hugging while Lara and the object is separated by collision (pre-v52 only).
-
If the game skips a dialog line during a conversation, you need to reload a savefile made during the run. You are allowed to restart the process if this happens, but the time is running in the meanwhile.
Please discuss.
On Alt+F4: I'd still disallow doing them, since some people use these cutscenes to go to the toilet, or get food, or whatever else. I usually drink while they last.
PBS end trick: You can argue both ways here. This is either a fault coming from poorly written code, or this is an issue in the level design, since this trick could've been eliminated by placing the trigger further from the door. Even though, there is a similar technique which allows grabbing stuff through walls, I am fine with grabbing triggers through walls, because you neither continue running on the other side after you're done with the trick, nor you grab any actual items. However, this is definitely not a trigger bug. The trigger bug comes from the broken coordinate calculation in the P3 executable, which causes Lara's meshes to stretch across triggers on the map. You can see the stretching when Lara disappears for a frame or two.
About runs on the board having tricks we don't consider fine for glitchless, I would leave a note on the runs' submission page which would be something like this: "This run was made before the glitchless ruleset update. The trick at x:xx:xx is not accepted anymore in this category." No penalty would be added.
On moon jump, I'd include it in the rules as such: "Boosting Lara's jumps by reloading a save made mid-jump to reach normally unreachable ledges, triggers, or to clear gaps." The "normally unreachable" still feels vague, though. So as Cadarev said, a case by case examination will be required. But what Plastic said is also right - I'd say, if half a second elapsed since pressing jump, you can safely save and load that file back later, since the distance boost you get is almost negligible at that point. I can imagine situations in which that small boost would allow you to cross a gap, but I think that would be rare in general.
So in the last few days I've got some remarks about the glitchless ruleset so I'd like to discuss it, and change it a bit. I would propose the following ruleset to start:
The following tricks are not allowed in glitchless:
- Clipping through collision: by for example, using the stealth glitch, crouchsaving, pickup glitches, floorclips, or by using the slope in Aquatic Research Area to get Lara into a glitchy state
- Activating triggers away from their actual positions (referred to as trigger bugs)
- Pressing alt and F4 to cancel triggers
- Speeding up dialogue sequences by manipulating your computer's playback devices
- Cancelling fall damage by rapidly quicksaving and quickloading
- Picking up items away from their pickup radius
- Swimming in the air
- Going out of bounds
Problematic tricks:
- Slope bug: exists in v49, patched in v52. However, you can walk on slopes where the floor and the slope meets even in v52, so I'm not sure about if this should be allowed or not.
- Moon jump: This trick is basically unavoidable, since it happens any time you do a quicksave during a jump, and then you load the save file. Even though, flying high up to the sky to reach platforms and activate triggers is not something I'd consider glitchless. I'm really clueless on how should we handle this.
- Clipping through collision: the Strahov railing clip. This wasn't communicated well. This should not be allowed in glitchless imho. Although there are multiple runs on the board currently applying this trick, so I'm proposing the following. Runners who used this will get a penalty time in their submissions, and if they submit an improved PB, these runs will be removed from the leaderboard.
Miscellaneous:
- Cancelling Karel's projectiles by quicksaving and quickloading: imho, this is fine for glitchless, since accidental projectile cancels could be only avoided by disallowing saving in the boss room, which would be quite stupid.
- If you accidentally do one of the glitches above, that is fine, as long as you made a save before, and you load that.
