Just wondering what the censuses on AHK is in Undertale.

I know that anything above 1:1 input:output is obviously cheating, but I was more curious about remapping keys to make a trick easier, in this case lab skip.

Most runners have keyboards that allow for many inputs at once and use it for Sans fight. My keyboard doesn't allow all four keys which isn't a big issue on Sans but it hinders my lab skip.

I can't hit left up and right all at once but I can remap my keys so I can hit j i and l all at once.

Would remapping my arrow keys to alternate keys to let me keep up to other keyboards be allowed or would it be frowned upon?

Edit:

my script I plan to use is as follows:

j::left k::down l::right i::up

I don't think that would be allowed as it could allow for unfair advantages or something. For lab skip you could use both the arrow buttons and the numpad at the same time, like holding left and right on the arrows and up on the numpad.

I'd like to but I don't have a numpad on my keyboard (laptop). I know some people run with controller AND keyboard and if numpad does work, I don't see an issue with having an alternate set of arrow keys that is only used in one spot that others can do naturally with their standard keyboards.

We do not condone the use of scripts or macros for speed runs. Making an exception once for someone paths an unwanted example that can lead others to use scripting/macros. It has been a general rule for speed runs of PC games that if the game does not support key remapping, it is illegal to use a separate utility to do so.

Thanks for the official reply, I guess my only option will be buying an external keyboard that supports multiple key stokes at once. I suppose you can lock this now as my question is answered.

Edit: I guess at that point it's technically a TAS.

I don't understand why using a keyboard to input via num pad is allowed but achieving the same effect via software isn't. Remapping stuff should totally be allowed, unless you want to ban all but one type of keyboard.

Remapping can lead to people remapping there z button to one unit per scroll of the mouse. Could also lead to people binding 2 buttons to 1 button making mashing faster. By getting rid of it all(even for those people who want to have a 1 to 1 ratio for key mapping) we can safely assume no one is using double binding technique and almost guarantee that they aren't cheating. For Example if someone were to mash faster then any of the top 10, without ever practice it would be put up for question. Hidden 6th mod out.

@Momop If you want to get a good cheap keyboard for multiple inputs, I would recommend the Logitech K120. Tuxwizzle uses it himself for his runs.

If changing keyboards is allowed then building a mouse that has scroll up counts as Z arguably should be allowed.

gonna +1 what backsapper recommended, i use it for dustforce and it has lasted me well over 2 years in a pretty input-intensive game and only costed 15 bucks... no ghosting issues, never dropped inputs or anything, dont know if you can find anything better for the price

@TheMilkMan47 what? Just... what? That argument makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. How is getting a better keyboard in ANY way similar to binding scroll wheel up to z? Especially when the game doesn't support changing key-bindings?

The difference Milkman for this is that Windows does not have that functionality out of the box. You would have to use a third party program to bind a keyboard function to a mouse, otherwise all mouse functions come out along the lines of Mouse0, Mouse1, Mouse2, Mouse3, etc.

Not if you make a really weird custom mouse. Or how about this, what if someone happens to use a keyboard that uses scroll wheels instead of keys? It's a stupid argument though, yeah.

Again, the control for those keys would be mapped through a third party software. You would have to tell that "scroll wheel" to specifically press Z and/or X. Since Undertale does not offer any control editing for keyboard controls, that would be illegal.

Question: To me, it seems as if despite the rule, your only way of determining whether someone's mapped Z and X to a scroll mouse is if they're suddenly mashing at ridiculous speeds, and that's the main worry. Wouldn't making the rule something along the lines of, "keys are only allowed to be re-mapped to other keys on a keyboard" solve the problem of someone trying to cheat in mashing, but also allow people with keyboards that have weird arrow key issues to not be forced to find alternatives?

I'm chiming in here to say that we're discussing it now. I'm going to leave these 3 questions here for some brain food. Ultimately, this will have to be settled via community vote, but let's try to think more about this.

Q1) Will the rebinding be advantageous vs. non-rebinding? How so? Is it significant?

Q2) Does it allow for new strategies or make a previously-thought non-human strategy possible?

Q3) Is the sole reason for re-mapping ONLY for the sake of usability? Or does it introduce something new, such as "turbo" functionality or multiple key activations per keystroke?

Some of my thoughts on the matter:

If it allows for "turbo" functionality, it should be banned. If one keystroke allows for the activation of more than 1 keypress (i.e. more than a 1:1 mapping), then it's banned. If it allows for a better usability, but grants no extra significant advantage to a run, AND the game does not allow for remapping in the first place, then let the community decide. If a trick that is thought to be non-humanly possible is now possible with the remapping, then let the community decide.

With punch card strats now, there shouldn't be an issue on lab skip for any keyboard now. I did buy a keyboard that allows me to do the skip anyways (better than a laptop keyboard). If something new comes out, then let's talk, until then it doesn't need to be allowed.