Greetings everyone! We are grateful that we have been given the mod role for the KH2 leaderboards. We will all do our best to fulfil our role as moderators to the benefit of the community. In light of this, we wish to make modifications and changes to the KH2 speedrunning scene.
FIRST and foremost we would like to make some beneficial changes to the leaderboard layout:
New KH2 Category Extentions: We want to fill KH2 Category Extentions with more categories that are just for fun.
Miscellaneous: We want to fill Miscellaneous with runs that don't start the timer at the title screen (ex. Data Org, CoR, Hades Paradox,and Mushroom 13 RTA) and remove those that do (ex. Platinum Trophy RTA)
Gold Crown / Silver Crown: We want to add a Dropbox for the Crown categories to clean up Leaderboards. (like the Misc tab ALL crowns will have ALL difficulties available.
'More...': We want to change standard and proud from being classified as misc sub-categories on the Leaderboards as it makes it tedious to view all categories/consoles and somewhat downgrades categories/consoles that are hidden. Draz has already done this so let us know what you think.
SECOND,We wish to add new categories to the website, the categories presented are categories we believe would be a good edition. ALL of these categories will be voted upon by you, the community. The categories that receive the most votes and positive feedback will be implemented. People can also introduce their own category ideas! We will not force any of the below mentioned categories to the Leaderboards. New Category Ideas:
Puzzle% : Collect all puzzle pieces and complete all puzzles. Timer ends either when Mickey Symbol pops up or Xemnas is done (To Be Discussed).
All Super Bosses% : Beat ALL Superbosses in the game. Timer ends when you kill the last boss available.
Keyblade% : Acquire all Keyblades the game can offer. Timer ends when you collect the last keyblade available.
Bronze Crown% : Ends either when you do Lingering Will/Data Org/Mushrooms (3 Different Sub categories).
Most Worlds% : Complete all worlds other than OaW/Atlantica. Timer ends at Final Xemnas kill.
Underdrome RTA : Complete all cups for the Underdrome in Olympus Coliseum (OC) when talking to Panic. Timer starts after first cup is selected, Timer ends when you finish the last round for the run.
100 Acre Woods RTA : Complete the entire book (Doesn't include first visit (Hollow Bastion 2). Timer starts when you enter the book, Timer ends when you get the Orichalcum+.
All ASS% : Beat Sephiroth and all Absent Silhouettes. Timer ends when you beat Sephiroth or Final Xemnas (To Be Discussed).
No Abilities % : Complete the run without equipping any Abilities on Sora. (For Lv1 equipping No Experience is required).
LASTLY, we want to change/add some things on the website (for example Guides). KH2 SR Website:
Guides: The guides have been abandoned and we wish to revive the section of the website with updated Menu notes and Speedrun guides.
Resources: The 'Splits' Section should be filled with blank splits for all categories (Worlds Splits & Sub Splits). The 'Tools' Section should be filled with differing links such as speedrunning timers, recording/streaming software. The 'Saves' and 'Patches' Sections should be removed as we are unable to provide anything for these sections.
Rules: The rules will be looked over and re-worked to benefit the community and make it harder to abuse.
THESE are the changes that we wish to implement in the near future. But we don't want to do this alone!
We welcome the community to help bring forth ideas and changes they would like to see, as well as assisting in the creation of new category ideas and the management of the resources/guides, as we believe there are many detailed and well made documents that will benefit being shown to the public. Please give us constant feedback on the changes we want to make as well as any potential changes that we might not have presented. Don't hesitate to provide documents and ideas for review but do so in a reasonable manner. Remember, we are all on the same team and we need to work together for the community to advance.
-InsertLogicT -CrystalCrown13 -BigSid119 -Bizkit047 -Wyattw8
No Menu%? (Complete the run without ever opening the KH2 menu. If Level 1, equipping No Experience is required and is the only time allowed to open the menu).
I think it is a great that you want to tidy up the leaderboard a bit and I personally believe that the changes you guys came up with seem reasonable.
Most Worlds is a legitimately great category. We as a community still have a lot to work on for things like Scar, Hyena Chase, Solar Sailer, and Explosion strats in the late game. Beginner and Crit can probably get some use out of final form in SP2 and maybe TWTNW. AND the exp route changes with more worlds, I don't even know if that's polished yet. It's a big open frontier and the strats are so much fun to work on when you don't have to worry about 100AW and Atlantica.
All Superbosses is my ideal long-form category. Silver Crown sucks because of CoR skip, Silver Crown NMS is fastest with Terra+Mushrooms (which sucks), Gold Crown is arguably dumber than Silver Crown NMS because you're just wasting time doing CoR skip, Gold Crown NMS is good but for me, since I only play level 1, gearing up for mushrooms just isn't appealing. Plat and JJ are way too long... but All Superbosses... that's the Goldilocks solution, it's just right. The only BS is 100AW, Atlantica, and farming money for 99 ethers in the postgame, the rest is just fights and fights and fights and fights. And I love fights. It's Gold Crown NMS with mushrooms traded for Sephiroth, that's the best trade of all time.
So those are my votes. As always, I disagree with All ASS completely because the AS fights are trivial in the late game, and I think giving Bronze subcategories has its heart in the right place, but nobody's gonna do mushroom%, if you beat data org you probably wanna just go for all superbosses, and terra% could probably just be its own thing, which might be kinda cool if peter pan weren't so broken. Sucks you'd have to sit through the credits though...
NO ONE is going to agree with this, but I think we should just ban CoR skip entirely and stop dealing with this NMS vs Regular crap. It's a neat trick but what's really the point of a gold crown category that doesn't do CoR and data org? "you cheated not only the game but yourself," etc. If you dont want to do those just do silver crown.
@KBM I hard agree that we should ban CoR skip since it just doesn't feel right and it's the easy way out. But that's just me, other people find the trick appealing so I don't know. We would probably start arguing and basically never stop.
You can’t ban a trick because you don’t like it. The point of a Gold Crown run is to get the gold crown - which you do while using CoR Skip. Like it literally fits the definition of the category. Having a NMS version makes sense since the two runs are different. But if a glitch allows you to complete the run according to the rules of the category, you can’t just ban it.
I don't think CoR skip should be banned at all. That's like saying to ban RNG manip because "That's not how the game should be played" or to ban death abuses because "Well why are you even playing if you're just going cheat by dying." Regular gold crown and NMS require two different routes when you want to complete each. There's no reason to ban it just because "it's cheap and doesn't feel right."
I see no reason for CoR Skip to be banned at all, considering it saves a ton of time in Gold Crown runs over going through all of CoR and fighting all of Data Organization XIII. That's why we have No Major Skips (NMS) for Gold Crown runs for those who don't want to do CoR Skip and fight Data Org. With CoR Skip, the Proof of Nonexistence chest is there after going past the forced fight triggers and the invisible wall in CoR, so it still meets the requirements of getting Gold Crown. Banning CoR Skip just because someone doesn't like it is bad and if you don't want to do CoR Skip, just don't do it and let other people have fun with CoR Skip if they want to.
I think the ideas for the new categories look really good and I'm excited to see them in the leaderboards. About CoR skip, I disagree with it being banned (maybe there should be a poll to decide this?), we should keep both NMS Gold Crown and "real" Gold Crown.
I can see both sides saying something in favor. Also there was never a debate between mods to ban CoR skip. For me personally I would cause what's the point in doing Gold Crown with the skip and not do just Silver Crown? For me that's just a waste of time. If people want to do it so be it I don't have anything against that.
At best I would put Gold Crown with the skip to CE. But again that's just me. And I'm not the only one who has to decide for that. If we ever thought about it and the community said no we wouldn't do it. Also we never said that we are going to add all categories. That's up to the community.
I'm happy to see that you guys are already heading towards having more fun categories for more people to either dive deep into routing/creating strats or just have fun running. I don't have much to add personally but just want to say this is a great start so far. Also the adding of necessary resources/guides I'm very happy to see being planned to get done. I hope that the worries of barren leader boards doesn't stall any ideas because I personally believe that people seeing options and opportunities for them to do something fun. Yes you can run something without the leader board but I personally see having a leader board as a invite to do it.
Okay I don’t usually chime in on these conversations but this one is important to me.
As someone who has ran both gold crown categories extensively and have absolutely put the most time into routing and running the categories. They both offer completely different routing, strategies and cor skip actually features a glitch in this game, which is so rare because other than cor skip, it’s the only one in the game. It’s visually stunning but still difficult to pull off. Calling it “the easy way out” is not doing it justice.
If this somehow gets considered to be a rule please consult the actual gold crown runners, including myself. But I strongly disagree with this on all fronts.
Just like you voiced your opinion people voiced their opinions as well, I don't know what you are on about. The only backlash people voiced was on twitter and that only by a few persons.
Edit: Ok, KBM removed his message from here so my answer goes nowhere now but I'll keep it in here.
well you guys went straight to twitter with that one, didn't you. it's okay to disagree about things, wish we could have had a normal conversation about it
Those weren't reactions, they were ridicule. Straight up making fun of people for having a different opinion. You're right about one thing though, I absolutely should have expected it.
edit apparently i need to clarify, I meant the stuff on twitter was ridicule. Everything in this thread is good, this is where this stuff belongs. And I'm not saying like, oh you hurt my feelings, I'm just frustrated that we can't ever talk about this stuff without getting the mob involved
