For those who haven't seen it: https://www.speedrun.com/post/6ry4z

There are a few questions that arise out of this:

1. I'm guessing most people do think that runs using infinite jumping should be separated from the current any% runs, but where should they be located? What should the category be called? Does the current Any% need to be renamed?
2. How should timing be done? RTA or IGT? If RTA, should we move the leaderboards entirely to RTA? Last time this was discussed, general consensus was that IGT made it much easier for runners to submit. Has that consensus changed at all, or should this IJ category be the exception in timing?
3. How seriously is everyone going to take this category? Is it the new Any%, or is it just a meme category? If it's a meme category, does it need to have a place on the leaderboards?

#1, I personally think the current any% is more of a glitchless category, it would be cool to have less restrictions on any% runs, but people probably wouldn't run it.

#2, if we move to RTA then we should consider ending the run at 'Speak Now...', which would make versions not matter as much, so we could marry the two leader boards. I know there are a lot of issues with that though (especially with other categories), so it's just a pipe dream tbh.

#3, it's probably a meme, the game crashing is just a pain, I'm not sure the glitch can be executed with any real consistency (at least in my testing)

I think VVVVVV leaderboards are a good example of how we might handle this. Any% is down to 37 seconds or something there and it's a little bit of a meme with fewer players running it, but being a meme doesn't make it an invalid category. My thoughts:

• Any% pretty much becomes anything goes for glitches: Infinite Jump, Hollow King Skip (won't be necessary in IJ runs but still legal), and Password Storage (presuming it's ever found to work on the Steam version) are all fair game. Alt+E abuse would probably be included here too although only working on Mac and Linux makes this a little finicky and you could debate this aspect of it. This could be run as an IGT or an RTA category. You could even include both and have one as a miscellaneous category if enough people are interested in each but I don't think the community will be large enough to support that. I wouldn't make decisions about this until you hear from a lot of runners about whether they'd run both/either/neither version of this.

• The current Any% category and associated runs become a "new" category, which could be Any% Glitchless (or Any% No Major Glitches like you see in a few games). No timing changes or anything else, just a new name for the category.

• I understand why you'd want to merge the leaderboards for nonsteam and steam turnipp but I don't think it can ever really happen (short of JKP going back and adding SUPER room to nonsteam which would be ugh).

• Considerations on how this effects other categories, like Low% and 100%, should be made at this time as well.

I don't believe Infinite Jump should be allowed. Me and Sig have been looking into it and it relies on a bad entity pointer. we're working on adding it to the glitch guide, but it's pretty complicated shit. But basically it looks like it will vary widely from computer to computer depending on OS and memory management, so it's inconstancy is akin to the lag glitch. The underlying issue that causes the glitch is a major run time error caused by memory mismanagement and in all honesty should be patched.

I think an Any% with all glitches allowed would be a reasonable category which wouldn't detract from the current Any% except for a change in naming conventions. Given Any% in VVVVVV (where they actually use an older patch of the game to perform text storage since that game did get a patch to fix the issue) and ACEs in numerous other games I would say that there's precedent. It's broken af but it's the fastest way to complete the game and that is generally worth making space for on a speedrun leaderboard.

I think we should probably leave the leaderboard with IGT for now. IJ is only reasonably usable in any% and even then I don't think we should make it the main category because of how unstable the glitch is. Adding it to the leaderboard as a seperate category would be fine as far as I'm concerned, IF the glitch is usable on at least almost every machine. Otherwise it's just unfair to those who can't use it. Can anyone report the glitch not working so far? If so I would probably change my position from slightly for the new category to slightly against it.

Finding a stable way to get IJ would change the matter. Then we would certainly have to reconsider RTA vs IGT.

An independent discussion should also be had on the rules for any% using IJ (even if it's not on the leaderboards). Mostly about wether we allow New Game after the glitch or not and on the rules for timing. But there is still enough opportunity for that once we have decided on the leaderboard matter.

I think we should make a new category which is any% where this is the route run, and use RTA on that category only, pretty much the same as VVVVVV. VVVVVV uses IGT on everything except any%, and any% uses RTA, I think we should do the same thing, since any% is more about exiting and entering, when the rest should use IGT because you never really exit the game. We should also make it like VVVVVV where any% glitchless is the main category featured, and any% is not the main category being run.

I agree with this. As stated above, the fact that this is even possible will give rise to speedruns using it. It makes the most sense to use a timing method which encompasses the entire route, where IGT doesn't account for a setup.

Similarly, Super Meat Boy has misc. categories for Any% in which other massive glitches lead to an absurdly short time.

Seeing what people have wrote above, I would agree that the current any% and an any% that allows ALL glitches could be a thing. We could even utilize the categories we already have. We have an any% and a any% that uses an unreliable glitch (lag%). If we repurpose lag% to "anything goes," then we can have a category that encompasses everything while still keeping the current leaderboards intact.

I personally don't see myself running IJ, but allowing it in a glitched category (that I remind you we already have) would be good. On top of that, we can do a thing where we have variables for each major glitch (similar to Antichamber). Then, you can easily see what glitches were used in the run.