Now that other people are figuring out how to do the tricks in pal just wanted to see what others thought. I think either way we should get rid of the "glitched deathless" category. Should we just allow pal in all categories that it works in? (not sure it fits the spirit of the no warps run including the breaking into the background) Or should Pal get it's own cats in general. Since the runs that are in glitched deathless are really just any% deathless runs if we allow that stuff. well and any% runs technically too.

But I did specify 100% as NTSC atm since it's different amount of grinding to get to max. Still a weird design choice, unless it's a limitation somehow of Pal. Makes final boss ridiculous.

Oh man. I got a WR time in Glitched Deathless just about at the same time that you posted this! haha! So I'm too full of bias to comment on removing the Glitched Deathless category, but I'll weigh in on some of the others.

My vote is to allow PAL in all categories. It's inferior to the NTSC version in most categories, and renders itself a poor speedrun choice in most cases. The Garloz skip from the Grappling Hook to Rolsa is the major benefit.

But In my opinion, the Garloz skip renders Rygar out of bounds, and "warped" to another part of the game. It looks different from the other wrong warps, but accomplishes something similar. Meaning that trick wouldn't be permitted in Any% NWW, neither would the Belzar skip.

So I'm not sure that any category needs to be categorized as NTSC-only, as a PAL run by default wouldn't be ideal or competitive in most categories. But for clarity, the rules for NWW could state that the PAL Garloz glitch specifically isn't permitted.

Also, there's already a ton of different categories that offer fun gameplay options. I think adding PAL-exclusive versions of those categories would clutter things up. And, as PAL isn't very popular (glitched deathless is its prime category, and that may get nixed), I fear those boards would be somewhat dormant.

100% as NTSC-only makes sense to me!

Those are just my thoughts.

Thanks for opening up discussion and for being such an attentive mod, ShiningDragoon!

No Warps Deathless and Glitchy Deathless then? Or whatever name people want to call it, Warped Deathless, Warp Deathless, Warptastic Deathless.

Not sure if no oob needs to be added to no warps though... I think Pal is slower without access to warps overall so not sure if necessary in the end.

And obviously a 100% Pal can be easily added if anyone wants to do that.

I dont know enough about the PAL differences to weigh in but I trust Dragoon and Peco's judgement :)

I think having the some familiar/shared verbiage between the categories makes them easier to understand and be recognized. NWW already has Any % NWW, so NWW Deathless makes sense. And there's Any %, and Any % Damageless, so Any % Deathless would seem to fit. Although Warpastic Deathless sounds amazing. :)

Fair and good call on no-oob for PAL. Makes total sense.

And I hadn't even thought about 100% PAL, but maaaaan I want to play it now!

Yeah no for now I'll keep oob in Any% No Warp Deathless. I mean it does save some time. But also you aren't just warping across the map or to another boss room. You still have travel time across the map.

If people are just blowing the others out of the water for a "mostly intended run" I might rethink it. But for now we'll just let more people play the way they want haha.

How many places are you able to oob in pal? I know i've seen the WR TAS do a couple places. Not sure how many are viable, especially in a mostly as intended run. Since you are going to each place in sequence.

I'm afraid I can't answer the PAL oob questions. I'm still super new to it, but hope to keep learning.

It's possible that more "glitched deathless (PAL)" runs could lead to more OoB discovery and possibly other PAL categories.