While discussing adding No Major Glitches, I figured that All Story Missions could be replaced by it. Clearly I was wrong in thinking it was so simple, and so will treat it as a separate matter. Now's the time to see if another leaderboard change can be made, anyway. So instead of wiping out any semblance of an all missions category (silly in retrospect), I propose upgrading it to All Missions (actually all of them).

The change would be relatively small; from my understanding, All Story Missions is every mission that changes the name of the save file, EXCEPT street races and BMX/NRG challenges (correct me if wrong), and also bans gang territory skip. All Missions would include everything, including the street races and BMX/NRG challenges, and the GT skip ban. It would unfortunately make all current ASM runs obsolete, but also make it a more complete All Missions category. This is probably how it should've been to begin with, but better late than never.

This is coming from someone who's never run ASM or 100%, so I'd like opinions. I'm open to keeping both categories available on the leaderboard for people to try out running All Missions before anything else is changed, or something else.

I feel the "change save file name" for all missions isn't a good indicator for it.

I personally think all of quarry should be part of this named category. With how the rules are written also this would mean no instapassing to gaining the asset.

I'm sure others have different opinions of what is and isn't a mission also.

If nothing else it could remain the same and have the name just changed to All Missions with the rules worded in a way that makes every mission currently done in that category considered "all of them", perhaps

That rewording of the rules would be "complete all missions which have a permanent marker on the map when CJ isn't close" or something worded in better English.

Wouldn't need to include the "excludes this and that and this" with that definition.

Questions:

1. is Quarry a permanent marker or when CJ is close?

2. BMX and NRG don't have markers why should they count as missions?

3. if BMX and NRG are added might as well add freight than right?

That was in response to mmhd suggestion of keeping asm how it is and changing the name to all missions.

Another definition of all missions could be to complete anything with a red starting mission marker. Valet hype!

GF hype! kidding

alright if it can stay the same i would be cool with that but if change is needed i would like to hear what is or is not a mission and as well being consistent along with the whole 3D Trilogy. This should also be agreed along most of the runners. i think that is fair.

Please let's keep this open minded and keep the trash talking out just one time.

I made a long post about the name/rules for the current ASM the last time they were discussed and nobody seemed to have a problem with it (given that there were no counters or suggestions despite asking for them)

The goal for a category name is to be a description of the run, and the rules should be simple enough for everyone to understand, while being technical enough that they don't have any loopholes or semantic problems

The old post is here

https://www.speedrun.com/gtasa/thread/ojzq3/2#x85zl

(Note that I wasn't particularly happy with the definition I presented exactly because of what Tirean said earlier: it's a bunch of do this except this and that)

I'd also like to note that Valet Parking is not a mission script

mhmm..... i looked over that post and it seemed after the fact the issues down at the bottom where fixed with just no duping however it left instantpass open as that should be ban as well but i would like to hear that one out first before i give my full input on that.

i guess i need to watch both 3 and VC AM and see what is and isn't done and try to see if it can work in SA AM unless someone can break it down real fast for me that'll be really awesome!

right now i am more leaning on keeping it the same but would like to hear about i said at the top though and the input others have along with it.

For the 0318 definition: 3 does everything ("story" missions, RC missions and offroad missions) VC is a bit weirder because Rockstar reasons ("story" missions and for some reason Distribution) SA is even weirder ("story" missions (only EOTL3 counts, not 1 and 2), and for some reason all races, BMX and NRG challenge (these last few are excluded from ASM))

I do not see why duping/instapasses should be banned, that feels like a very arbitrary restriction. As long as all the missions required are passed, why limit the ways through which they can be passed?

Okay. Thank you @Powdinet

the racing feels like unneeded time to do a run and it's not a consistent thing through out 3 and VC needed for AM and that rounds me back to what AM for SA is now doing Zero, Driving School, Wayne cars and Casino Heist would to me sound about " equal " to 3 and VC. if something else should be added RNG and BMX can be added too i guess, but again it feels unneeded time adding for an AM run still willing to hear the other side of this though not shutting it out by many means.

now what you said about EOTL 1 and 2 and about duping tbh i'm very open to this idea idk how others are about it and looking above " All Missions would include everything, including the street races and BMX/NRG challenges, and the GT skip ban. " it seems like this is a non duping run but again open to both ideas. and i also understand both reasons.

however i need my sleep therefore i shall visit this tomorrow when i can to see what comes about.

@Tirean we could probably name it something like "Named mission" (Stealing idea from Chain Game on GTAF) or you know... Maybe call it "Missions that were given to player by characters/cutscenes/phone calls to advance the story line". Apart from doing 100% goals, what's the incentive doing races or the mentioned BMX/NRG challenge?

I didn't like this at first. I thought about it, though, and I'm a fan.

It's a new category, and a new way to explore the game through routing, running and chipping away at a record (unless @FLYlNG just crushes us) - it's a fresh opportunity for the community to work together on a run (although I'm probably being optimist here, it might not have much attention) and also it's an even better way to expand into 100%, because you're doing more of the optional objectives than you'd normally do in ASM.

I think skipping gang territories should be allowed.

Doing All Missions (by the savegame name rule) would certainly bring it a bit closer to 100%, which would be in line with the argument that was made about it being a bridge to 100%. Definitely an interesting idea. Although All Story Missions seems nice as well, just because it's kind of playing through the whole story. A bit theoretical for me since I'm not really a runner for these longer categories. I guess it wouldn't hurt to add it additionally for a while if people are interested in it.

Well, if you went AM (incl. BMX, NRG etc), how long would the run actually take? It's cutting off a good amount of content, but some time estimates would be decent. If it's still over the 10hr mark, I'm not so convinced by it.

Any 100% runners want to chime in on this?

If it is only races, nrg and bmx then a little over an hour added. So say your average person run would be around 7:35-40

would the courier(s) and vigilante count in as well? idk if they change the save file name but if anything is going to be a " bridge " to 100% this would seem the true way without doing the collectibles. now this would make this run about 8-9 hour run and this wouldn't be a category that'll do anytime soon and tbh i kinda hate that but i'm thinking what is best not what i want.

Edit: but if we where to allow these added missions i say duping and Instantpasses should be allowed back in.

Vigilante/paramedic/firefighter/taxi/pimping/burglary does not change save file name and I'm 95% sure courier doesn't either.

so that'll kick it back to just SF/LV/RTLS racing with BMX and RNG added in as well.

what is everyone take on allowing dupes and Instantpasses?